Again, being a Honda/Acura…I don’t think this would be a smart move. A V10 engine is inherently more expensive to design/devolop and produce, why not just go with V8s? IMHO it’d be stupid to “use less powerful ten-cylinder engines in its more premium models” than just go with a standard V8 just for the sake of spec sheet.

Why ? That wouldnt make sense Acura
They just need to get a 4.2L V8 in the RL skip the RWD and use the smarter more advanced SH-AWD and make the RL larger next time. Increase the V6 to 3.7 to match the MDX
Put the V10 in the NSX of course, limited numbers of course
Put a V6 in the RDX. Maybe not the 3.2 but the Honda 3.0 and tune it for more HP. Mid cycle styling update including the MDX crest so it looks identical to its sibling
The next TL with SH AWD permanently or as an option. Use the 3.5 in all models. Nav standard hard drive in nav etc. Try and keep the price under 40k
The next TSX needs a small V6 with SH-AWD as an option. No more 4 cylinders

yeah…totally, the V6 can’t get you to your destination fast enough. Even though there are governors on every car that are illegal to remove.

A V10 would not be as fuel efficient as an equally powered V8, I dont think they will sacrifice their reputation.

Personally I prefer V-8’s for the sound alone. While some V-10’s sound pretty good, such as the ones in the BMW M5 and the Porsche Carrera GT, the V-10 in the Viper sounds very flat and dull, like a UPS truck. Engine sound is important to me, and the poor sound of the Viper V-10 would prevent me from ever buying that car over a V-8 powered sports car.

I don’t know what Honda’s adversion is to V-8s is all about.

With all respect to Honda I don’t believe know what they want to do with Acura or what Acura should be. It was the first premium brand from Japan and I owned their Legend, which was an excellent Honda and was sold under Honda moniker all over the world.
They will need more cylinders if they want to compete with BMW & Benz, which is only Lexus achieved in no small part because Toyota’s luxury sedans are accepted in Asia as luxomobiles. And they achieved it without Lexus moniker. Now they introducing Lexus world wide and it works.
Honda does not have mass/volume/depth of product line to do this. Honda is a bastard of Japanese automotive society, build against establishment: Toyota, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Isuzu. They live on what they earn and get no subsidies and not involved in koreitsu: Japanese institutional mafia. Therefore, if they would achieve the status of Volvo & Audi they would not need V8 or V10. There are not that many Audis with V8 or V10 will found homes anywhere else but in USA. Furthermore, this market will die out with cost of gas. Why not settle on nicely tuned V6 diesel and call it victory in numbers?

M5? M6? They only sticker $14,200 to $29,200 more than a SRT10 Viper, in Canada. Let alone a 650i coupe, whose base price is $2000 more than a viper.

Autonut hit the problem on the head. Infiniti and Lexus have squared themdselves up gainst their German rivals
Acura has not really defined a rival making it hard for a consumer o klnow where to put them. Then introducing underpowered flagships to a power hungry, status and brand obsessed conumer market really takes its toll on the company. Acura really needs a V8 in its TL and RL as upgraded models. The V10 should only be avai;able in the RL as a special edition only.

I think it’ll be a good move. Honda’s racing divisions all over the world have been building great V10s… and V8s since forever, and as we’ve seen many times before, Honda isn’t afraid to let it’s racing technology trickle down through it’s regular car lineup. I agree that a V10 exhaust note isn’t the most aurally stunning noise, but just imagine the sound of a V10 VTEC on the big cams! And they said they’ll start with a sports car first, and see how it progresses so I’m all for the idea.

??? Remember the F1 spectacular blowups of 2004/2005/2006? Hope that doesn’t trickle down.

Anybody who knows anything about F1 knows that every F1 team has had spectacular blowups. BMW had more than it’s fair share throughout ‘04 -’06… you don’t see M3s and M5s blowing up on the road now, do you Jazz… and don’t even get me started on McLaren Mercedes… spectacular blowups are the main reason Kimi still doesn’t have a title. Even ultra reliable Ferrar has them… as I recall, it was one of those spectacular blowups that officially took Schumacher out of the running and handed Alonso the championship in ‘06.

Acura has defined themselves as a luxury car but not to the level of a BMW or MB. They are with Lexus and Infiniti but with a little more emphasis on tech and sport. They need to get rid of the 4 cylinders. Infiniti replaced the G20 and I don’t think that Lexus every had a 4 cylinder.
They need to take things in steps. It makes no sense to not do a V8 and go to V10. Even if cylinder shut down is used it would be less expensive to develop a V8 As far as RWD it is not necessary bc its a bitch in bad weather and as far as handling SH AWD will handle better anyway.

You ask why? For SHAME, I ask, WHY NOT?!

Nigel Tufnel: [pointing to a customized Marshall amplifier head unit] This is a top, to, uh, you know, what we use on stage, but it’s very, very special, because, if you can see…
Marty DiBergi: Yeah…

Nigel Tufnel: [pointing to the control dials] …the numbers all go to eleven. Look, right across the board: eleven, eleven, eleven, eleven…

Marty DiBergi: Oh, I see. And most amps go up to ten?

Nigel Tufnel: Exactly.

Marty DiBergi: Does that mean it’s louder? Is that any louder?

Nigel Tufnel: Well, it’s one louder, isn’t it? It’s not ten. You see, most… most blokes, you know, will be playing at ten. You’re on ten here, all the way up, all the way up, all the way up… you’re on ten on your guitar. Where can you go from there? Where?

Marty DiBergi: I don’t know…

Nigel Tufnel: …nowhere! Exactly! What we do is if we need that extra… push over the cliff, you know what we do?

Marty DiBergi: Put it up to eleven.

Nigel Tufnel: …Eleven. Exactly. One louder.

Marty DiBergi: Why don’t you just make ten louder, and make ten be the top… number, and make that a little louder?

Nigel Tufnel: [pause, blank look and snapping chewing gum] These go to eleven.

could this be the start of dedicated models? Is honda entering the luxury market?

jonnycat, Viper and M5 are almost the same MSRP in the US. About $83k.

But the M6 should definitely not be mentioned in the article, as it has a much higher MSRP (almost 100k).

They did forget the cheapest current V10 powered car, however – the Audi S6. That one is $72k.

hey why not skip v10s and go on to v12s? After all, Acura wants to rival Bentley doesnt it?

jamaicandude :
1) The Mclaren was not competitive more due to the failed MP4-18 & MP4-19 chassis than engines but i’ll give you a few failures from Ilmor.
2) Kimi could have won the championship even with the blowups except for that idiotic tire change rule that robbed him of a full race victory.
3) BMW blowups did occur but the car was shown to have tremendous grunt. The Honda was still midpack in power with blowups. Sato was able to blowup an engine twice a weekend for awhile.
4)The M3 does not have a V10. The V10 in the M5 is considerably larger and beefier than any F1 engine and has better cooling and libricating abilities

Now back to Honda. I stand behind my comment on a V-10 from Honda because Honda has never brought an engine to market over a V-6 but they intend to skip the V-8 and go to a V-10? Further Honda likes compact designs which would cause more stress on the engine than needed. If they think of putting the V-10 in more than the purpose built NSX then they’ll have to fit it into the current dimensions of an existing car. Not good for engine design. It may work in the RL because the car is larger (in theory) but I’m not sure how big the actual engine bay is.

I love honda/acura. I currently own a 04tl and a s2000 I know they have the tech.to do what they wants with engines my only concern can they sell it. Only a few people have confidence in them to spend over 80k on their cars the first thing they are going to say its only a honda.Prove yourself more before you make that giant step

tripleonefive, great post. exactly what I’m thinking

christianboy10,
How do you like your 04 TL and would you trade up for the 07 Type S ? Just curious

tripleonefive,honda has some great inline4s some of the best in the world N/A like S2000, Integra TypeR, civic typeR and RSX type S I dont think they sould stop making them

hey tiponefive I woudnt because the price I have the 6speed and love it if i want the o8 look i’ll buy the up grade

Well I agree with you. They make great engines I would argue the best in the world but they should keep the 4 cylinders with the Honda brand.
If they want to take Acura upmarket to play with BMW and MB they will have to get rid of the 4 clylinders. Even if they have the turbo I think its bad for a luxury brand to have 4 cylinders.
They already have the reliability and the resale of the Germans but MB doesn’t sell any 4 cylinders in the US, BMW stopped with the 318ti a years ago and Infiniti and Lexus don’t have 4 cylinders either. I think for an upmarket car line the 4 cylinders have to go

that makes sence

autonut: at least you called it a “premium” brand and not a “luxury” brand. They’ll need more than just more cylinders to compete with BMW and MBZ, but it’s a start.

Jazz: datsun and toyota’s faux-luxury division don’t have any german rivals.

1115: your second post makes a lot of sense. But I don’t think there are a lot of people in bad-weather places who want a “sport/performance” car as their only vehicle

55amg: that’s comical as hell. Rivaling bentley! Hell, first, they have to figure out a way to rival Hyundai

I hear you Jazz, but the reason I said M3 is because V8s are what F1 is running now, not back then. And don’t forget that F1 isn’t the only form of motor sport Honda’s involved in. Matter of fact, Honda already did a concept Legend with a V8 from their Le Mans program (Mugen Legend Max) and it fit quite nicely in the engine bay. The engine wasn’t bigger dimensionally than the J series V6 motors.
Also, mentioning the fact that the M5’s V10 is larger and beefier than any F1 engine, with greater cooling and lubricating is pointless: what… do you think Honda would transplant an F1 spec engine into a road car? You can’t make direct comparisons between a street bound engine and a race one.
And, history has shown in Formula One that the teams who generally have engine trouble are usually the ones behind in pace (thus they have to tune their engines to the very edge to keep up and that increases stress on the engine), and performance isn’t only linked to the engine in F1. Honda’s engines this year obviously have the grunt (check the trap speeds on the low downforce circuits) but their aero package has been pure rubbish. Their excuse has been incorrect calibration on their wind tunnel, and at Monza, they proved that the car does have pace when it’s less dependent on downforce.
I don’t disagree with much that you’ve said though. I just think that Honda does have the technical expertise to bring a V10 powerplant to the marketplace. Previously they’ve focused their efforts on extracting big power from small motors, but I don’t think the V10 would be difficult for them.

Another Crummy, Useless, Rotten Automobile

jamaicandude you got some good points(are youa real yardman or just the name)

JJt
I’m not going to lie that was a funny acronym. Its unfortunate that its so far from the truth. You are still an idiot of course but that was funny.

christianboy10:

100% born yard man. Been an avid car and motor sports fan since I was a kid, F1 being my fave. (been watching F1 since the late 80s, & haven’t missed a race in 4 years)

same here nuff respect

Wow am I an idiot?

I can’t take credit for tehn acronym, as you may well have guessed.

Always Unsafe Designs Implemented
Bad Mannered Wankers
Built Under Inspection of Cooky Korean
Can Hear Every Valve Rattle On Long Extended Trips
Could Have Remained Your Sickly Lame Elderly Relative’s
Drips Oil Drops Grease Everywhere
F**king Italians Ain’t Trustworthy
Fix Or Repair Daily
Got A Mechanic Coming
How Odd-No Damn Acceleration
Hope You Understand Nothing’s Driveable And Inexpensive
Just Empty Every Pocket
Nasty Import Sucks Savings Away to Nippon
Overpriced Leisurely Driven Sedan Made Of Buick’s Irregular LeftoverEquipment
Please Leave Your Money Out Under The Hood
Plenty Of Noises That Irritate And Clank
Pulled Over Regularly So Cops Have Enough
Send Another Automobile Back
Very Old Ladies Vehicle Only

Agreed with 1115 (for real)

V10s (along with V12 and V16) were used for a short time in the 1930s and that’s where they should stay. In today’s market, you need smaller and more fuel efficient engines that are more powerful (such as in the Cadillac CTS where the new direct injected version is more powerful and gets better MPG than the regular V6). Big engines are not a good idea in today’s market.

jackjimturkey, you missed few, but not many:
Found On Road Dead
Fix It Again Tony
**** Turned South (no offense intended to anyone driving preference or pseudonym)
Dick Turned South (see note above)
Poor Old N…er Thinks Its A Cadillac

LOL LOL at the PONTIAC

Yeah lln your stupid, did you forget the S6 has a V10 and costs less than both the M5 and M6?

Autonut: i just grabbed one. several were funny. i ignored the Complimentary ones.

How Your Average Nerd Drives An Import

And for Geo

Guy Earns 0

global_lighting– i dont know what the **** that was but it was awesome

OHHH now i know why theyd use a V10 because theyre easier to make into torqueless pieces of garbage just like almost every other honda.

VTEC – Virtually Torqueless Economy Car

lol A4 I hope you dont drive one If you do buy an extra ignition coil

1115: I don’t like variable valve timing, but the NSX was one of the few applications thereof that I could live with.

I really hate the brand names most companies use to describe their particular approach to VVT.

Vtec is about the best such name.

I guess it might make sense depending on how big of a V10 they’re planning on

VTEC was the first now there is VVT VVTI MIVEC and who knows what else

Christian
I dont think they are trying to squeeze 80k out of an RL or MDX. I’m thinking they want that money for the NSX. If they put a car above the RL maybe the HL it would probably be around 65-70k I guess. I think they will just make the RL larger and stick with the V8 and SH AWD. Infiniti uses the M45 as their top car
I agree that companies should prove themselves but people on this board don’t believe in that. These Acura topics seem to be bs. They need to get some spy shots of the new TL and TSX
I think the 09 is going to end up looking like a Maxima from what I can tell with the camo on it.

A lot of people keep debating on the validity of a V10 engine in Honda’s luxury and sports sedans, when the article clearly states that they intend to do a V10 sports car first (likely an NSX replacement) and “maybe” move on from there. This is a lot of fussing over a very big “what if”. The V10 NSX would be a piece of cake for Honda. Let’s reserve judgment for the rest of the lineup IF they make it to even concept form with a V10 motor.

for my bentley post, it was a joke

Let Everyone Xperience Useless ****

tripleonefive
the reason I said over 80K there were an earlier article about honda skipping MB and BMW and head straigth for bentley and ferrari’s compititon

Yea I remember that. Thats why I say these post are all bs I want to see more of the 09 TL

tripleonefive
of all those vv bs out there some works not all. The honda vtec does but only the ones on the s2k and nsx and the type r motors the s2k over 6grand its like another motor kicks in, you can feel the car pull then you get that high rpm to finish the job.thats why I like the inline4 with 140hp N/A it feel good when I kick those v8s tail

Christianboy
Thats what I’m talking about. When are they going to redesign the S2000? I’m a little mad at Honda bc they canceled the Prelude. My brother had a 2000 SH and it was sweeet. It got stolen unfortunately. I understand why Honda had to cancel it though they had to make trucks and SUV’s. I know that Acura is getting separate R & D centers in 2009. I think the product is different now but they will really be different in the next models cycles. Even then the domestic dickriders will still say “Its just a gussied up Honda ” lol

u8init: Brilliant!

“Anybody who knows anything about F1 knows that every F1 team has had spectacular blowups. BMW had more than it’s fair share throughout ‘04 -’06… you don’t see M3s and M5s blowing up on the road now, do you
Comment by jamaicandude, posted on September25 at 11:32 am ”

Actually, the E46 M3 engines were blowing up on a regular basis on the street. It got bad enough that BMW issued at least 2 recalls for the problem and extended the engine warranty to 100k miles to protect resale value for existing owners. It was the right thing to do, because if they didn’t, M3 resale values would have cratered because people wouldn’t want to buy a used M3 that may grenade its engine.

I believe you Z06ified, but I was actually talking about the current M3 with the V8 ( though it isn’t yet released in the US). That’s why I made reference to BMW’s Formula 1 engines. I couldn’t have been talking about the I-6 models. And I must admit that i never knew about the E46 recalls. You learn something every day.

@BAMF,
That’s a scene from the movie Spinal Tap. It’s a cult classic ‘mockumentary’ about a failing British heavy metal band in the early 80’s

Here’s the video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhVWJgIzftE

BUILD V8s AND THEN MOVE YOURSELF UP HIGHER WHEN NEEDED TO.

jjturkey: HYANDAI?