That sucks! What’s wrong with Acura these days? They need to just do what Audi has done; essentially be both a Tier 1, TIer 2, and Tier 3 luxury car company. Tier 1 (Audi R8 V10, A8 L), Tier 2 (Audi S5, A6, Q7, TT-S), Tier 3 (A3, S4). After that dentist grille, it’s been all downhill for Acura!

——- Acura hoped to build “glamorous, gorgeous products that would sell ——

I assume they were referring to a future lineup of models since that surely does not described the current mess. Maybe someday, someone in Acura will remember that the girl in school with the mouthful of braces rarely got asked to the dance.

It goes without saying that without a line of RWD automobiles, Acura will always be a sub-Tier 1 player. Like Audi.

A) It’s still a market and a lucrative one, so why the urgency. (Yes, there’s more margin in higher niche markets and less cars to sell to make those profits).

B) If they really wanted to the top tier then why would you ever release a sub-par hatch like the RSX under the Acura brand? Nothing exceptionally wrong with that car (or right with it). Gotta be careful, Cimarron destroyed Cadillac’s reputation for a LONG time.

I remember laughing when they announced they would be a “Tier 1″ auto company, whatever that means… I guess they learned you can’t just move yourself upscale with hopes and dreams.

Acura needs new management now!

As long as Acura has the same lukewarm modest mindset for their products, they will never be considered a luxury brand….PERIOD! Instead they will keep the label as glorified Hondas. It’s upsetting that a division with so much potential is holding out….it keeps buyers away. A good example is what they did to the Legend which sold well and was capable only to replace it with the RL which turned out to be one of the biggest turds in the auto industry. Acura needs to pull their heads out of their asses and start building cars that justifies a $50,000 price tag (The RL is not a $50,000 car).

Smart move. Geely has a better shot at Tier 1 than crApura.
That is, unless crApura was shooting for Tier 1 in the Clowncar crowd.

DenverGuy217 – +2 Internets for you. Best comment I’ve read in a LONG time.

howsmydriving, explain to me how Audi is any more subpar than BMW or Benz? The new S4 has been unanimously voted better than the 335 and certainly better than the C350 on all levels, and the R8 V10 is a halo car that is right up there/better than the overpriced parts-bin-sourced SLS, and lets see… nothing from BMW? The S5 runs right alongside both the 335 coupe and the 650i as well. Get your head out of your ass. Audi is on the same playing field.

I actually like this message for q change. Acura lost its footing (and Homda to some degree) by straying away from their roots. The roots have been: form follows the function via superb engineering. And their form wasn’t that bad, never Maserati or Ferrari (well there was a gorgeous NSX), but engine, transmission, suspension were coming first. I see a bit “back to the future” in current Accord and maybe in Civic, albeit in bloated beyond necessary form. After all, Honda is not known for great looking cars, but for great handling and driving cars at prices regular folks could afford.

I dont know of any Asian auto maker that has “glamorous, gorgeous products”. Certainly not Acura or Honda, or as Smegley might call them, ****onda

@A4 – Sadly, performance doesn’t equate to brand status.

Notable examples: 1991 NSX, 2010 LFA, 2008 GTR.

Don’t get me wrong. Audi is a good brand, and is a notch above Acura, Lincoln, etc., but to many like me, it is like Ferragamo to Louis Vuitton, above the rest, but not quite there.

Smegley Crapsalot – why is Acura crappy?

I miss the days when Acura had offerings like the NSX and the Integra Type-R. Neither of those vehicles were very luxury oriented but delivered fairly good performance for their price. Hopefully their new market strategy might include some less luxurious but better preforming cars. I mean, if Hyundai can make a decent RWD coupe while not breaking the bank, surely Acura could do the same or better…

It takes exceptional products and big marketing bucks to create a viable Tier 1 brand. In my mind, the last exceptional Acura was the Legend. OK the new ZDX is exceptional. Exceptionally UGLY. The TL is actually their best offering right now, spoiled by that hideous guillotine grille. The RL has never lived up to the Legend’s promise. The TSX is just a warmed over Euro Accord. None of their offerings are segment busters, and all look too much like gussied up Hondas. They need a more distinctive design language, note that’s distinctive in an attractive way.

As an acura owner, it is laughable to attain tier 1 status.
I think that sticking to entry-luxury/luxury sport is what they do best.

I liked the new TSX when I drove it a couple weeks ago and was all set to buy one. Problem was the high headed Acura dealerships weren’t going to knock down the price to the reasonable level. Even on a used ‘09 with almost 20k miles it was near $30,000. Now what does this say about it being a tier 1 brand? The TSX, while a nice car, is no 328i or even a C-Class but a medium level Accord minus the V-6. How can you sell this type of car and expect to be equal to a RWD German built car?

I would never go into a German car dealership and think to buy a year old 328i for $24,000 – but to me, that’s what an Acura is worth – less.

2morrowdesign – I’m all with you, except they seem to have abandoned luxury sport as well.

One area where Acura really lost their footing (beside styling which is just a given these days IMHO), is with the coveted repeat buyers. Something the Honda division excels at.

When the svelte 2004 TL was introduced, the Acura used car lots were brimming with older TLs traded in for the new model even with the higher price tags Acura was moving up into. When the most recent TL was introduced, you saw few of the previous TL models traded in towards a new one. Every TL owner I know won’t go near the new one.

A Tier 1 player often keeps a customer for life or at least through many model changes even lackluster ones.

bah, jake, i was going to fight you on your last use of ‘accord’ with respect to the tsx, but i let it go…now? i’m still tempted, but i know it won’t get anywhere ;P i agree with acura re-focusing on entry level…that’s where they need to be…that’s what honda built their automotive reputation on in the first place…

btw, there’s an ‘09 tsx w/nav, auto tranny & 10k miles for 31k list price on cars.com right now @ Frank Leta Acura…the other ’09s are ~10-16k miles and 29-30k bucks…

there’s a bigger price drop for ’08s (25k) and ’07s (23k), from what i can see…

I still do a double take whenever I see an NSX. Now I turn away when I see the front of any new Acura. What’s even worse is I was following a new TL the other evening and noticed they’ve molded the rear bumper fascia where it meets the bottom of the trunk lid to mimic the beak on the front. C’mon Acura… two wrongs don’t make a right.

I think Acura needs to be a little more refined inside and then they will be on par with Lexus and Infiniti. I believe thats all they need.

Gee, I didn’t see this coming. Why, I don’t understand how they can just give up the goose. That lineup of FWD and biased FWD cars all powered by the same V6 should have been more than enough to catapult Acura past Mercedes! Who needs 600hp V12s and 500hp V8s from other companies when you can have 280-300hp V6s? 8-speed automatics? Psssh! All anyone ever needs is a slightly bigger or slightly smaller Honda Accord, or a slightly nicer Honda Pilot with edgy styling ripped off (partly) from Ingolstadt. All this garbage about manual transmissions, high-revving specialty engines, who cares?

Acura has dug itself a hole of irrelevance for nearly 15 years now. It started with the end of the Legend in 1995, and reached its crescendo with the death of the NSX four years ago. Acura is a company that, if Honda puts enough effort into it, may actually put the Honda brand out of business. I can’t see how Acura’s cars don’t compete with the very models sold under the Honda name, in part. They’re not that much better, to say nothing of competing with the IS350 and 335s of this world. Acura is a company with a seemingly total lack of lust to compete on anything but high volume pseudo-luxury four doors. They still have nice stuff like the MDX, but they appear to prize irrelevancy.

Acura needs to reintroduce an updated version of the first generation Integra, which was light, handled well and cost less than an Accord.

They also need to introduce a compact RWD sedan the size of the TSX and a full size the size of the RL.

Acura made its first mistake by abandoning model names and introducing meaningless names like TL, RL, and RSX

I agree, Swamprat. “Vigor” was a pretty cool name…even though it didn’t match the TL car it was attached to. Still, wish I had been old enough to buy one of those before they all disappeared

If they keep offering cars with the strange & weird (at best) design cues such as their new “shields” front… They can probably never have the chance to become “TIER ONE” player (not even a strong “TIER TWO.” Everyone is learning and catching up…

Audi is a great example. Its not as strong as MB or BMW in the USA, but its actually overtaking them in Germany & certainly China as the largest luxury maker for those key markets by building great cars.

Infiniti basically count on one strong product (the G37) in comparison to Acura’s TL ( seems to lost its steam with current model.) Even Hundai with their TIER 4 image can push and sell lots of Genesis these days tells you a lot.

Its sad to see Acura abandoned names that started it all (ie. LEGEND) and be pass by new comers from Genesis to even Buick.

just look @ its cars…nothing tier 1…..!

Leftwing – I drove the car you just mentioned! I also understand the comment about it being a middle of the road Accord w/4 cyl was a little harsh – it’s still no G37 I could buy at Bommarito for $30k though.

I didn’t want to spend over 24k – and to me personally, an ‘07 TSX just isn’t worth the same as the car I ended up buying for 23k – the S80. I still like that TSX – but for that kind of money for what is a old bodystyle I had a hard time going for it. My good friend bought one from Leta – an ‘07 w/auto but with more miles on it for like $20k. I wanted less miles so it was going to be 22-24 and that was a no-go.

everything but “sux” should b off da table.

cimmaron was horribkle

Acura SUX! day are glorigfied hobnda Sux + -0 = Sux!

audis R GR8

Y is Acura crappy? Bcuz tyhey R made that way.

Lexus SUX!

g37> Buick > Genesis> Acura

This news comes as no suprize, as it seems that they have DRASTICALLY cut product quality over the past two years. They can’t compete in tier 1 because they don’t offer anything that lexus doesn’t allready offer. Lexus itself is spending huge amounts of money developing its name and image just to ensure that they can compete with the german brands in the future, I think it was smart of Acura to stop fighting a losing battle.

I didn’t say this Tier-1 monkey crap would fall apart last year
No I didn’t!

To be Tier-1, you have to have 3 things
Product Innovation
Commitment to Excellence
Guts

The Hondas, the Lincolns, and the Hyundais of the world are sorely lacking in two, or three, of those ingredients

This is about as newsworthy as violence in the Gaza Strip
Next
DrFill

Those prices on the used TSX’s are a joke. You can click carsdirect and get them on a new one with no effort. Probably almost another in it if you try.

** almost another grand

i think that all car companies in the segment have something to be learned from audi. For a brand that has not even been in the U.S. more than 25 years, they are doing wonderful things. They have done a miraculous job of being a car company that many people want to be seen with (if you were a business person, and you were going to go to a meeting where you might get a promotion, which would you drive, an audi, or a yugo). They achieved this through being MODEST, their cars are very understated, not very attention grabbing, but they are pleasant to look at, acura and lexus can learn from this. Audis are also available to any person who walks into a dealership, that is, there is always an audi that fits YOU. They are available in all prices and levels of sportiness, and when you buy an audi, you actually get the car you want, no compramises. Audis are made of quality materials, mercedes and bmw have, in their lower models suffered from low quality issues to make a larger profit margin, this gives the consumer a feeling that they have gotten their money’s worth, a feeling that, i, at least find very important in making a purchase. Audis are very capable of doing long stretches of 120mph in germany, whereas a japanese car would probably wreck its engine and suspension in just over 30 minutes. Lastly, there is not really anything to gripe about with an audi nowadays, the styling is good, the performance is good, the quality is good, the price, is right. If acura could lean from audi we would see a total revamp of EVERY car market that would make competition between brands and rultin what i think could be some really great cars in the future.

*result in*

curse you spell check!

Reed
Your plea for Audi love is as desperate as it is fruitless
Your hatred of Japanese luxury cars is as pointless as it is ignorant
So congratulations on Weakest Post of The Day!

Audi doesn’t have to worry about Tier 1 status either
DrFill

at least audis dont need corrective facial surgery, as to my post, i was bored

Dr fill
audi has a tier 1 car, it’s called the A8L w12. if thats not tier 1, then japan is eternally screwed

If Acura style keeps it’s current heading
They won’t have any status in the US in 5 years
DrFill

No offense Acura, but when you axed the NSX and RSX, you killed your own dreams of becoming a teir 1 company. NEXT

wow dr. fill, you must have a boomerang bigger than your precious TL’s stuck in your head if you think acura can keep going the same way they are and succeed.

HEY EVERYBODY, new NURBURGRING LAP RECORD!
Gumpert apollo speed congratulations!
This should get interesting.

http://seriouswheels.com/cars/2009/top-2009-Gumpert-Apollo-Sport-Nurburgring-Lap-Record.htm

Bye bye corvette and viper, there’s a new sheriff in town.

Well actually Radical makes 2 street legal production cars that are faster than the Apollo around the ring.

Acura will never compete with Buick so this is a non-story. They could barely keep up with Saturn and they are trying to stay competitive with Buick???????? AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Good luck with that Honda. Your quality is a joke next to General Motors, your reliability is laughable when your vehicles end up in the junkyard once the warranty expires and your quest to match the world standard in interior quality and style, luxury and class that buick is known for is the biggest joke of em all.

You should save the money up to transfer all your scumbag employees back to Japland where you belong.

Be American. buy American. Buy GM.

yeah, smeg, those are dealer prices…not quite a “no haggle” bargain price…

sounds like you made the right move, jake…me, i’m just a craigslist whore these days…check this out (totally unrelated): http://stlouis.craigslist.org/cto/1448952551.html

unbelievable…but 10 mpg…if i bought that, and actually admitted it here, i’d never hear the end of it…

“Need more Oil for GM” you are an ignorant idiot, Most hondas are made in Lincon Alabama, Marysville Ohio and East Liberty Ohio. Most “American Mades” are made in mexico and canada since they had to shut down most all of the union controlled plants. Do you not remember the 10,000 layoffs earlier in the year?

Go buy Crap from Obama Motors and watch it break! Then lose your ass on trade in because people with common sense don’t want it!

Well, Acura and GM have one interesting commonality… they price their cars with a lot of aspiration and optimism. Too bad reality will bring them back down to earth.

I was looking forward to the future front wheel drive limo and super car, too bad.

That’s an awesome find Leftwing. I’d seriously think about buying that if I had the garage space!

All the usual bickering aside, it seems like the key point here was lost on some of you. The message is pretty clear that Honda Corporate is taking back control of what had become an independent US operation at Acura. And “big changes”…? The comment by Colliver being refuted by Takanobu doesnt bode well for him. I’ll be watching to see if he’s canned and if Marek will follow. That will tell me more about Acura’s next steps than anything. And without discussing designs, their product line placement have been pretty poorly chosen. I hope they do go back to their origins: Precision Crafted Performance. Theres enough boring Lexus sedans and SUV’s on the market already without copying them. But in general, I think the US Honda presence (read: Honda and Acura) has been pretty poorly led, so I think someone will get the axe….my money is on Colliver’s head.

I see by your posts “Need more oil for GM” that you cannot contribute anything of intelligence. Perhaps because your mama dropped you on your head when you were youg. Oh wait a minute maybe she dropped you on your head a few dozen on your head while drinking some PBR in your single wide.

I don’t understand how people are comparing Acuras to Hondas. Just because there is no RWD doesn’t mean that they compete with 25-30k cars. That’s ridiculous. Acura can still compete with Infiniti, Lexus, BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Cadillac, etc. w/o RWD. AWD is just as good.

Guys– Acura is still relevant. Honda can and does make some very, very good engines, and they have made some beautiful cars. They have the talent, and if they use it, they are a huge threat to the brands listed above.

NSX
MDX-compete with X5, Q7, etc.
RDX-Compete with X3, Q5, etc.
Legend- Compete with 7, A8, LS, etc.
RL-Compete with 5, GS, etc.
TL-Compete with 3, ES, etc.
TSX-Compete with A4, IS, etc.
TSX Wagon- Compete with CTS wagon, A4 Avant, etc.
TSX Coupe- Compete with TT, IS-Coupe, 3-Coupe, etc.
New Convertible Model-compete with G37 Convertible, IS convertible, etc.
Integra-Compete with A3, etc.

Type-S across the board save for the Legend to compete with AMG, M, etc.

Make that lineup a reality and Acura may be the new Lexus in sales.

Aggie
Uhhhhhh…….you might have missed the article’s jist
It is very clear that Acura has NO intention of becoming anywhere near as successful as Lexus
They seem very content to sit on the sidelines
Hoping someone sleepwalks thru the door

They certainly don’t have the product to drive them in
And aren’t looking to make any

I can hear the snoring at Lexus Headquarters from here!
DrFill

Well, ….. I guess after owning 2 Acura RL …. Honda does not want my future business.

Simple as that. Goodbye Acura, sorry you couldn’t cut it.

NoChance I’ll be back, my $$ are going to a tier 1 car maker.

As an Acura owner…I like the way they are positioned, but they need to do just a little more to compete with the likes of Lexus, BMW, Infiniti etc. The one thing I like about BMW is in the 3 and 5 series, you can get a 6Speed Manual with any engine matchup (except the 550)…Acura needs to do that. I have an 09 TSX – and was tempted to get a ‘10 V6 – but the lack of the manual trans stopped me from going that route. Second…eliminate Torque steer. I know a Honda company is never going to RWD platforms…but Honda is very innovative. If they could eliminate the torque steer issues they have, and do better manual trans. matchups – they would have great handling/performing cars.

Just my 2 cents.

“I can hear the snoring at Lexus Headquarters from here!” — DrFill

I can too. I think that they looked at one of their cars too long. At least they werent driving them.

I agree that it is tough to swallow some of the aesthetics of the latest Acura products, however; I have come to enjoy them quite a bit more in their steel flesh. Sometimes the beak-like “Power Plenum” looks ostentatious but I have seen several of the new TL’s here in Knoxville that have had that beak painted the same color as the car. The look is devastatingly dramatic. I always loved the TL that was introduced in 2004 because of its “mean” demeanor. With a body colored beak, the new TL looks downright menacing; especially in darker colors. I don’t think I will ever consider Acura a Tier-1 brand because of their lack of S-class and 7-series-sized vehicles, a V8 engine and the obvious requisite RWD. I will applaud Acura with a more “entry level” tact because that’s what they have always been good at. Sometimes there is a rather large grey area between Honda and Acura vehicles, but I think Acura can spice up the line just a little bit and create a large demand for their vehicles again. My wishes for Acura:

1. Nix the RL – let’s just get out of that territory. RL is a good car, but not good enough.
2. Revamp the RDX and use a V6 instead of the Turbo 2.3.
3. 6-speed automatic…made available on EVERY Acura model…NOW!!
4. Make the TSX V6 only. Revive the J30 (or similar) as base engine, J35 as Type-S (manual available on both)
5. Introduce a new coupe/convertible model (CL perhaps?).
6. A TL Type-S (3.7 HO, 6-speed manual only, rearward bias of the SH-AWD, body colored beak)

Now…these are my wishes. I know there are heady engineering and R&D expenses associated with revamping ANY vehicle, but I think if Acura became more focused they could surely steal more sales away from the bread and butter of the competitors (3, 5, C, E, IS, ES, GS, G, M, etc.).