they should change it to; “since medicare sucks, all of our customers already died”

So true. Buick is in a class by iteself. Bye bye Lexus, your buick wannabe days are over, time to crawl back into that pleather and bamboo encrusted Wok in which you came from. Americans are rejecting your sh1t cars for real cars and General Motors has got your number.

Starts with lexus and eventually Toy ota. Soon these sushi loving scumbags will be off our shores for good. Everyone would rather drive a real luxury car from Buick than a low quality, POS copycat.

Be American. Buy American. Buy GM

“hot” isn’t exactly the first thing that comes to mind when I think of the LaCrosse, or any Buick for that matter.

I like what I’m hearing
LaCrosse is a nice car
Could have a salad, and lose 300 lbs, doh

And they should keep Lexus out of their mouths
Only a true moron would compare a Buick to a Lexus
DrFill

Only a moron would claim that Lexus is on par with Buick.

Lexus doesn’t hold a candle to Chevrolet products like the Equinox, Lambda nor GMT900. Comparing them to the class leader like Buick is ignorant. Maybe your ignorance would be more accepted over in Japan.

Be American Buy American. Buy GM.

Only two morons would fight over which geriatric-focused tincan on wheels is better.

This coming from a guy who drives Volkswagens, I mean AUDI. Hope you like your mechanic shmuck.

i vote for NMOFGM vs DrFill cage fight !

That new Lacrosse will not only trounce Audi A4 and A6 into the ground in sales, performance, class and quality, it isn’t a total embarrassment to own like a POS from Germany. Lets see an Audi last 400 thousand miles without a problem. Buicks do all the time.

There’s a difference when you have a quality and dependibility leader like General Motors to back up a product rather than a company like VW who’s only claim to fame is snazzy, if not immature marketing.

Be American. Buy American. Buy GM.

Buick’s revamped advertising campaign has already begun, with new billboards that feature a photo of the 2010 Buick LaCrosse and such call-outs as, “Another thing for Lexus to relentlessly pursue,” and “EX your Lexus.”

I love aggressive marketing. Keep it up GM.

I’m not convinced that GM, or Chrylser, will survive. Have they really changed that much for the better?

“Buick- because all those darn Cadillacs are just too racy looking now”

lol wow nmofgm, they brainwashed you and you don’t even know it

“I’m not convinced that GM, or Chrylser, will survive. Have they really changed that much for the better?”

Be prepared for dissappointment, GM will be around forever and will continue to dominate every segment they enter.

Chysler is dead, victims of the American Revolution. They’ve been dead for years. I don’t know why the government even bothered to give them a bailout, it was inevitable that they would never recover.

Might want to get with the program and do like everyone else is doing and dump your VW for a superior GM vehicle. Remember, it’s not cool to drive German cars anymore. The Lacrosse is the hottest car on the market right now, consider it your replacement.

Be American. Buy American. buy GM

All GM needs to do now is bring over the Alpha platform that’s going to Cadillac and give Buick a small 2+2 seater coupe based on it, throw in the 3.0L 300hp turbocharged direct injection V6 that’s going in the SRX, price it in the $30’s… and call it the Grand National, and I will have one of those sitting in my driveway…

As soon as the sale of Saturn and Saab are complete, along with the elimination of Pontaic, GM will be smaller in US sales than Ford Motor. This is just based on numbers.

GM will most likely survive but they will not be able to transform any of their divisions into overnight successes. It will take years of hard work to get them even near to what Lexus has achieved. Also, I don’t know why people keep comparing Buick to Lexus. Lexus is on par (if not ahead) of Cadillac and Buick is designed to be a step below Cadillac. That’s another issue with GM management, understanding the place that their product fills in the market place.

Lexus is a joke next to Cadillac moron. They don’t have class leaders like the CTS-V nor do they have the King of SUV’s like the Escalade trio. Their POS RX paels in comparison to the new SRX and Lexass had no answer for the last SRX.

Get a clue. Cadillac is above the Germans, and certainly above any POS coming out of sushiville.

Now it’s Buicks turn to drive the Asians into the ground. And they will, trust me. They will all be victims of the American Revolution. Everyone would rather see GM succeed than anybody else. This is GM Country.

Be American. buy American. buy GM.

So, someone gave NMOFGM access to a computer again in the insane asylum again or is this just another guy poking fun at the original? I can’t even tell the difference between fake NMOFGM and the real one’s straight up stupidness. That’s bad.

Lutz is a good guy so I’m sure whatever he puts out will probably be right on and get people talking about GM again. He’s got this strange characteristic for an auto exec, what was it called again? Oh, common sense!

Oily – You make us laugh. You must be a GM employee. Only they could truly be daft enough to believe that GM will ever get back on top. Weren’t you the one who was so adamant that GM would be back up to 30 or 40 % US market share by the end of this year? Looks like they stay below the 20% mark.

I’m not saying that some of GMs new product aren’t good, but the company as a whole is a dinosaur and horribly inefficient. Not likely to ever get back to their former glory.

Oh, and GM quality? Shalll we talk about paint peeling (still happening on newer cars)? How many new launches have they had with recalls before getting out of the gate?

“Buick- If it wasn’t for China this would be an ad for Pontiac”

@NMOFGM: I do hope you are saying all this nonsense for the sake of stimulating conversation. If not then you have got to be the biggest idiot out there. Your whole “everybody would rather a drive a real luxury car from Buick…..” is complete BS. I have not agreed with most of GM’s actions, however I do give them credit for trying to make a comeback, but if your are truly an American and want an American made luxury car, buy a Cadillac. Oh, what can YOU not afford one?

OMG NMOFGM!! Where have you been you crazy mofo? Man its a good day. I’m glad your back from your long hiatus. The auto blog community hasn’t been the same without your silly GM antics. But GM has so much confidence in this model that its almost scary. To say that its a new class of luxury is one thing, but to compare to Lexus is another. This car is most comparable to Acura and Audi. While it is finally an upscale vehicle that is worth buying, its not Lexus good. That division is up to Cadillac to do. But when I think about it, Lexus and Buick are, or were, in the category for average buyers that are 55+ and retired. That’s about the only comparison there is between the two. If it was up to me to purchase this or the ES, I’d take the American all day.

How many Lexuses do they sell in China? I guess it does make Buick world class.

Although… I’m surprised that the Terraza lives on in China.

I will say that GM has come a long way in the last 2 or 3 years. They are STARTING to be compotent vehicles again. I have seen some nice things come out of their showrooms but it doesn’t erase the sour taste left by the last 10 years worth of vehicles. They will have to spend the next 10 years rebuilding their image more so than just their cars. I still cannot figure out why they decided to keep Buick over Pontiac. That seems dumb. Pontiac, with the G8 and the Soltice, was finally becoming a better brand. Just needed to do something about the awful G6 and made the Equinox equivalent, Torrent. I think killing Pontiac over Buick is dumb but we will see what happens.

Anyways @ NMOFGM – CRAZY MUCH!? GM has 2 vehicles that “dominate” in their class. The Corvette and the CTS-V (V-ONLY, not 3.6 or 3.6DI) The rest have never come close to beating the compeition. Have you ever wondered why when comparing American cars, they always compare them to other American cars? This is to make their case. People who buy American will always buy American so they see no worth in comparing it to Europeon or Asian cars and being on the receiving end of all the “un-American” complaints. The only thing American cars offer is a lower price, not better value, but lower price. To have better value you would need something of equal quality for a better price or better quality for equal price. The only few American cars to do that are the CTS-V (though I would still prefer a BMW M3 or upcomming Audi RS4) Corvette. (Still take M3 over Base Vette, 911 over Z06, and R8 over ZR1).

If American cars were so superior, why would they be having the trouble they are? If you can provide an EDUCATED respose to that, then my arguments will cease. You cannot blame the consumers because the consumers are all that matters in this scenario. You cannot blame buyers for buying other cars but rather blame the Big 3 for not building cars people want to buy. I say Big 3 loosely because they are no longer top companies. Worldwide YTD sales put VW #1, Toyota #2, GM #3, Hyundai #4, Ford #5, and Chrysler #6. I will refer to them by their numbers, so 356. They are the “Somewhat Large 356.” hahah

Someone please junk the clunker that is Need more oil for GM

Who came up with that stupid slogan? Not exactly easy to remember or say. They should have gone with something simpler, such as “Buick – The best” or something similar.

What I don’t understand is why no one has called this racist douchebag out on his bull**** comments.
NMOFGM you talk like a southern US white trash uneducated tool.

It is thanks to the Japanese automakers that we have the quality built cars found in NA today. North American automakers essentially went bankrupt recently because consumers realized a while ago that they were no longer receiving quality built cars that offer anything that Japanese cars didn’t already have. The “old” big 3 have been on the downhill ever since the 90s as imports steadily began to dominate each segment with reliable, feature-packed, and well designed cars. It’s not surprising that that GM has been knocked off their pedestal by Toyota as the largest automaker in the world. Consumers migrated to Toyota built cars because they have a rock solid reputation for reliable, cheap to own vehicles.

Buick may have excellent reliability ratings next to the other luxury brands, but their sales are pathetic and their lineup has been weak for a long time. The interiors lack the well refined, class leading design of the top tier luxury brands from Asia and Germany and the exterior design is nothing short of sleep-inducing.

I have to hand it to Cadillac for designing edgy, upscale looking cars, but that description only applies to a couple models. The Escalade is a joke; it is a bulky, poorly put together, gas-guzzling behemoth that is totally unnecessary to the market. The only reason it became so popular is because it was foolishly embraced by the hip hop culture as a status symbol (God knows why). While Cadillac may be the best off American luxury manufacturer they are still lagging behind the top models produced by Audi, Lexus, and BMW for overall performance, refinement and design. The breadth of models in Cadillacs lineup simply cannot compare.

I’m baffled by the ignorance in your posts and where you could possibly be getting these bull**** facts of yours. The CTS-V a class leader? Buick THE top luxury brand?. Care to open your eyes for a moment to discover that Buick’s sales figures in the past few years have been terrible, and at one point GM was considering dropping the brand all together to cut costs. I’m not making these statements based on second hand info either. I follow the industry daily and have driven vehicles by the brands mentioned. I was recently in a rental 2007 Buick Lacrosse and the interior did not scream luxury to me at all. Rough materials, boring center stack, dated gauge and climate control design. Simply poor overall.

If you’re going to make comments such as those already posted then you better get your facts straight. In nearly every segment Asian/German automakers have the number one car in sales or overall appeal. In many comparison tests the American brands will almost never place ahead of their German or Asian counterparts.

Simply because you reside in the US, does not mean you have the right to make racist, disgusting comments about other cultures. I’m not even Asian myself; however, I know what a well made car is and most of them come from the other end of the world (Europe included).

American automakers took a lazy approach their vehicles in the 90s and the Japanese swooped in with excellent cars that offered far more value. What happened? They took over the market and NA is all the better for it. Now it’s the American automakers that are playing catch up and there is no one with an education that can deny that. Consumers have displayed their preference, journalists and industry experts have stated the facts, it is clear who’s at the top of the auto industry now.

Take your KKK bull**** elsewhere. Leave the car talk to the honest, respectable enthusiasts.

NEW TAG LINE- Buick: It’s a Chevy with leather seats.

Some of your tools can’t accept the fact that Buick is the king of Luxury. Lexass, Acura, Infiniti, Audi, Volvo and Jaguar are also rans. Time to get with the program.

Come up to Michigan sometime, you won’t see a POS import the whole time. This place is dominated by Detoit vehicles, mainly vehicles from General Motors. Michigan puts into percpective the direction the Auto market is going. All Deomestics, with GM in front. Nobody in the world can stand up to GM when it comes to quality, relibility and dependibility and it’s not going to change anytime soon. Everyone will come around eventually and the American Revolution will be the only one standing while the rest of these imports are long gone. Look at China? GM rules. The world is catching on and quickly.

You dirtbag naysayers are in for a rude awakening. Save yourself the embarrassment and get to your local GM dealer and buy one. You’ll be buying the best product in the world. That’s a fact.

Be American. buy American. Buy GM.

The ‘new’ class of world class? Perhaps new to GM, but not new to to their customers who already know about BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Lexus, and Acura. This new line is only marginally better than “Take a Look At Me Now”, but both inevitably remind the customer of what Buick was not too long ago, which needs to be thoroughly forgotten.

SCOOP!!! Need More Oil for GM drives a Toyota Prius to work!

Hey NMOFGM. I thought we were done with you. Why don’t you lube up and bend over so I can teach you a lesson…

I live in Canton, about 20 miles NW of Detroit and work in Ann Arbor, about 30 miles West of Detroit. I see a lot imports in Ann Arbor, more so than American cars. I do see a lot of domestic cars in Canton but that is because many of Cantons inhabitants work for the Big 3 and they get MASSIVE deals on these cars. That is what I said, they are cheap, that is why people buy them. I work for a bank and I have my accounts there too. This is no different for someone who works at one of those companies. It is pretty much a prerequisite. I have customers who get cars for FREE from Ford, GM, and Chrysler just for working there. Executives but employees none the less. That is when you have hit bottom. That is why you see so many here. You have these line workers making $15 per hour and the only new car they can afford is the one they just built. This is because of the employee discounts and employee purchase plans.

Also, I look to China for quality products… NOT!! The quality of products that come out of China replicates the quality that they perceive when buying products too. GM can have China. I bet Chinese people think their products are of high quality too.

I think you must be on to something here. You should try to convince analysts, journalist, insiders, and even consumers, about your thoughts on the Big 3. They are seem to be under the same misconception that you say we (readers of LLN) are. They seem to believe that the American companies are playing “catch-up” while the rest of the automotovie world is just pushing ahead. I think that with the deficit that was left over the last 10 years by American cars, they will always be playing catch up. They will never be able to compensate 10 years worth of lost time without the rest of the automotive world stopping development and advancement for the next 10 years. They are done and finally realziing that a car that was popular in the 90’s isn’t popular anymore. Just took all of the first decade of the 2000’s to figure this out.

You cannot fault consumers for the demise of the Big 3. The Big 3 just aren’t building desireable cars. They become more desireable with DEEP discounts and incentives, yet are still falling behind. The “Somewhat Large 356″ (*See previous post) will always sell cars, but in smaller volumes to loyalists. I have, living in Detroit, talked to numerous people, who buy American simply because it is American. That is not a group I want to be associated with. Without weighing the merits or demerits in this case, they buy that car. It isn’t a candy bar where you can’t go wrong in your decision. This is, on average, a $30,000 decision that is the second largest purchase in most peoples lives. I would want more from this than “It was built down the street from my house” as the excuse (not reason) for buying it. This is going to cause problems as more and more drivers are on the roads each year and the Big 3 are having trouble drumming up NEW business.
Also, I have noticed that owners and employees of the Big 3 are the most defensive and opinionated about their choice. I WILL ONLY BUY GM. WHY? BECAUSE MY DAD/GRANDFATHER/ X worked there. That really has NOTHING to do with the car itself. Yet these people, sorry to say it, will drive their new Chevy to Walmart and fill up their cart with dozens of items made in China and Indonesia.
I have had people knock my VW GTI (MKV) choice saying “Should’ve bought American.” I say “What?” They say Focus, Cobalt, or Neon. You could imagine my amusement. I then get more amused at the fact that they know NOTHING more about my car than that it is a VW. Engine, transmission, fuel consumption, features/amenities, cost, performance, safety, etc. Complete Morons. Just like NMOFGM.
I do consider myself VERY opinionated about cars but I also consider myself VERY educated about the opinions that I formulate. Try me…

Sorry for the length. Just needed to vent. hahah

honestly i’d prefer he be banned for excessive trolling, but i guess LLN doesn’t see it that way

TornadoGTI – Though a buit wordy, you’re the kind of person I would enjoy talking to cars about. I too am very opinionated in my choices, but I educate myself (to excess sometimes) before making those choices. Admittedly, that’s why I’m such a strong Apple advocate over PC/Microsoft.

I still think OIL is some kind of plant. I really don’t believe that the “persona” is really that much for (or against) GM.

Yuh need ta throw some D’s on da b!tch | jus bought a cadillac | throw some D’s on da b!tch | jus bought a “lay-crosse” | throw some D’s on da b!tch

”

That new Lacrosse will not only trounce Audi A4 and A6 into the ground in sales, performance, class and quality, it isn’t a total embarrassment to own like a POS from Germany. Lets see an Audi last 400 thousand miles without a problem. Buicks do all the time.

There’s a difference when you have a quality and dependibility leader like General Motors to back up a product rather than a company like VW who’s only claim to fame is snazzy, if not immature marketing.

Be American. Buy American. Buy GM.
”

NICE ONE DUMBA$$ THAT BUICK IS JUST A REBADGED OPEL INSIGNIA, OH **** THAT’S RIGHT ITS A GERMAN VEHICLE DAMN I JUST BOUGHT MORE SAUERKRAUT

TheMegalodon,
I think we have all tried at one point, but realized that his arguments are equivalent to a f-ing retard who got locked in a house, was raped by some ex gm CEOs, and was constantly told that buick is the best car on earth!
It amazes me how, apparently these dumb mods on LLN, haven’t banned him yet! Or maybe they have, but not permanently!?! He brings down this website whenever he spews crap out of his mouth! Reading his comments makes this site worthless and a waste of time! You know someone is going to respond to him and ruin a thread!

Ricky, Buick is priced between Caddy and Chevy. However the new Buicks are performing and being built as well as the lexus models in the same size class at a much cheaper price.

BUT I do not see much crossover in customers between a LaCrosse and the similar sized CTS. Just not the same customer. I do not see Buick making $60,000 vehicles to compete against similar priced Lexus models. Buick is going to stay between Chevy and Caddy in price.

Well, NMOFGM, I have both VWAG cars and a Chevrolet, and a Jeep, yet I still find you to be a moron, and yes, my mechanic by the name of doc warranty does a great job.

P.S. the other reason Buicks last to 400,000 miles (if they even do) is because the person driving them has never had them see speeds of more than 45 miles per hour and even at that rate it takes them about 3 days to reach it.

Why are people fighting with NMOFGM? You’re spending quite a bit of time beating your heads against a wall, like idrinorbarsaku said it’s been tried before by quite a few people. I personally just skip over his posts now, rarely even read them.

The New Trash Of World Class

@SW: AMEN!!!

I’m surpised of the fact that some people still read NMOFGM’s comments.

Any attempt though to compare a Lacrosse with any Lexus is not valid. Lacrosse is in fact the new Vectra that goes against the Passat is Europe. And it’s not even sure that it wins…
Gm trying to sell this model as a luxury car is, in my humble opinion, a mistaken approach that will result to even lower trust from the market towards Gm.

Johnny, that’s a perfect sales line! If it wasn’t for China, we wouldn’t be talking about the demise of the Oldsmobile brand in 2001 but in 2009…

Caddy
I like the LaCrosse, but GM is desperate
Everyone wants to take a swing at the Lion

Buick is sold/serviced by GM dealers
ES350 by Lexus dealers
HUGE difference
Anyone who doesn’t know the difference should get a Genesis, a Phaeton, and a Buick and build a half-way house for wannabe luxury cars

LaCrosse starts several thousand less than Lexus anyway, so a sales numbers comparison will be useless

Desperate companies do desperate things
BTW, the Lexus is faster and more efficient, so Buick still has work to do
Can the pudgy LaCrosse keep up?
DrFill

“The new class of world class”. There goes GM again with an inflated sense of accomplishment. Like the ridiculous tagline “The finest luxury crossover ever.”

Ring
GM wouldn’t overpromise and underdeliver, would they?
No………
I can’t think of a time when they did that
I mean, their marketing initiatives have always been spot-on!

I see an abandoned Oldsmobile Achieva, rusting up the street, that will prove it…………..
DrFill

From Edmunds:

“Is Buick the New Lexus?
So it was only a little surprising that when the all-new 2010 Buick LaCrosse CXS (base price of $33,765) arrived at Edmunds HQ, it appeared more than prepared to take on the 2009 Lexus ES 350 at $35,345.

Anyone who doubts the LaCrosse’s mission is to compete with the ES 350 need only scan the lengthy standard equipment list and drive one a couple hundred yards. As Dan Pund said in our Full Test of the LaCrosse CXS, “Really, people, you’re going to have to get past your whole Buick thing. Wake up; times are changing.”"

It’s not a huge surprise the lighter ES 350 (by a whopping 472 pounds) outpaced the slightly more powerful Buick at the test track by about a half-second across all the sampled speeds. Then again, if a half-second matters to you, then you might be shopping in the wrong showroom. (Sport sedans are on the other side, sir, next to the branded athletic apparel.)

Come on, get over it guys. Buick is putting out a real competitor to the lower cost Lexus models and there will be more.

And the Vectra is not the LaCrosse. Sure they share floorpans and some suspension bits and a few components but that is about it.

@A4,

That geriatric tin-can statement was mighty fine.

@Need more oil for GM

You’re right about Buick being in it’s own class…class for losers!

is that a lexus ?

You guys are doing a great job on here with Need More Koolaid for GM. Keep it up. I needed a good laugh today. That guy never gives up. What a schmuck. Hey KoolAid, you ever read Consumer Reports? Or are they just as stupid in your book as you think everyone else is? Seems you are the minority. Get a clue one of these days pal.

One more thing
Let’s put the past embarassments of comparisons to superior Toyota/Honda products aside
I know around here logic will get me nowhere, but here goes nothing

GM just got out of bankruptcy, what, 45 days ago?
And they’re already popping off about Lexus?

That’s like Mitch “Blood” Green getting out of the intensive care and saying “Where’s that Mike Tyson? What a little punk he is!”

Come on, bro! Come on.

And LaCrosse is just as expensive as the ES, but won’t you lose like $4-5k on resale value when you trade-in down the road?
The Lexus is already faster and more efficient, so you do lose something on the road as well, everyday

And you certainly won’t get any star treatment in the Pontiac/Buick dealership, and they might spit at you when you need an oil change!
And it’s just as expensive?
Why is that?

Who is the better value again?
Uh-huh………yeah!
DrFill

carstuff,
I did drive it, way back when…..The car is not as impressive as it’s hype was! The features sound nice on paper, but aren’t good in the car! This lacrosse won’t be stealing any lexus owners any time soon…especially when the price is about the same!

A few thoughts after reading some of the above comments. If Buick is a Chevy with leather, a Lexus is a glorified Toyota (can you say a $40K Camry).

I have seen the 2010 LaCrosse close up and would prefer it over the Lexus 7 days a week and 2x on Sunday. The Lacrosse is stunning and the Lexus (Camry equivalent) creates as much emotion as a toaster.

Someone above also referenced LaCrosse’s routes being based in Europe and how that effects trust. Let us not forget that Mercedes in Europe is on par with Ford, and in many cases Mercedes in Europe normally end up as Taxi’s (Europe’s Crown Vics). As much as I think BMW is overated (I have not read a review on one of their M’s without it breaking down) they are the European luxary car.

is that a lexus?
no, i guess not. it does not look like a camry.

NMOFGM is right on the money, and his kind of modern thinking will continue to help high gross profit, Detroit Steel con men like me well into retirement.

first off, its is a nice looking car. but its nothing earth shattering, and that is the only thing that is going to reinvent buick. dont forget, slogans dont sell cars, perception and reality do. did “this is not your fathers oldsmobile, this is the new generation of olds” help oldsmobile? or how about “pontiac is car”. good grief, it was if gm (chevy) was trying its best to kill pontiac. it will take a generation to change buicks perception, and im pretty sure gm doesnt have a generation to wait. admit you were idiots, bring back pontiac and keep buick as a halo car. case closed.

Again more misinformation due to lack of knowledge.

The CXS starts at $33k and comes well equipped with heated and cooled leather seats. The base ES starts at $35k (cloth) and you need to add $2400 to get the same heated and cooled leather seats. So now we are up to a difference of ~5k.

This is how Lexus started. Offering upscale features at a much lower price.

But the real measure is not how us idiots throw around our bias’s and facts, it is how it sells. And right now Buick cannot build enough of them to meet demand.

“Automotive News is reporting that GM may increase production of four new vehicles due to heavy demand. The new-for-2010 Chevy Equinox and Camaro, Cadillac SRX and Buick LaCrosse are reportedly under consideration. “

Carstuff
A real point! (I Might be in the wrong forum, ok)

Lexus ES has sold 60-80k a year for the last 18 years
Let’s take out the base and AWD LaCrosse sales ($25-30k LaCrosse)
Go forward in time 12 months
And let’s see where it stands

When you go back to the future
Take the total LaCrosse sales, and divide by 3
(About 1/3 will get the top version)

For some reason, I’m not expecting 60k+ sales of the CSX
DrFill

I believe it was Edmunds Inside Line that recently had a shootout between the new LaCrosse and the Lexus ES 350. At the end of the test it was the LaCrosse that walked away with 1st place. They admitted to being surprised by just how good the new LaCrosse really is, and continued by saying it’s time to change the way you think about Buick. These are guys that are known for not going easy on the domestics. Could it be that Buicks goal of competing with Lexus is not as far fetched as some think?

ml350pc
“If Buick is a Chevy with leather, a Lexus is a glorified Toyota (can you say a $40K Camry). ”
Buick is an Opel with leather. Opel is the Fiat of Germany. They do very good work, but are still the cheapest german brand.

“Someone above also referenced LaCrosse’s routes being based in Europe and how that effects trust.”
No i didn’t. Prompting the car as a luxury item (which it isn’t) effects trust. The European version is well built with good driving features but not a luxury brand. Tries to be as much A4 as it can for the money. Audi is superior of course.

“Let us not forget that Mercedes in Europe is on par with Ford, and in many cases Mercedes in Europe normally end up as Taxi’s (Europe’s Crown Vics).”
Ok… (lot’s of irony)

I never said that the Buick LaCrosse CXS will outsell the ES. I do not believe that anybody at GM ever said they will outsell the ES.

I think all that has been said is that Buick is after the same psychographics that the lower end of Lexus is getting.

Buick is aiming for the mid market buyers that are not after a sports sedan, but a more luxurious ride.

And even if Buick hit the mark perfectly, they could only take away 1/2 of the ES sales which is 30,000 units of CXS.

If LaCrosse sells a total of 150,000 units this year they will be doing well. Of course this is well below the 300,000 units that the old Century/Regal used to sell. But then again they started at $19,995 and there has not been much price creep since then.

i didn’t know that all versions of the lexus/buick es came standard with heat and cool seats. actually it does not.
buick has made on hell of a nice car for the money. and it does not look like its younger brothers and sisters. hence, lexus looking like a damn douche camry or avalon.

TornadoGTI,
I think my passat wants your GTI!

I’m pretty sure I said this before, but I’ll say it again. I will wait for a year or two for real reviews. GM is known for having problems with their new remodel year vehicles.

Who let that fake bastard back in here?

I do have a nit to pick at this car though! When I drove this, a couple of months ago, There were something that felt really nice, and some things that were really really cheap! It’s in the places where you won’t look or touch too often….which, to me, feels like they cut corners.

alsvw, the base CXS, which is being compared to the ES, does have heated and cooled leather seats as standard at $33k. The ES has cloth seats as standard to keep the base price lower. I doubt you will ever find an ES with cloth, every one will have the $2400 package for a total of $38k.

Based on NMOFGM’s articulate comments, I recently purchased a Cadillac Cimarron. It truly is the pinnacle of luxury that Lexus could never hope to attain.

carstuff,
you’re wrong about the cloth seats on the ES! In the US, this car does not come standard with cloth seats. The 1st package, adds leather to other areas of the interior, and perforates the leather of the seats(for heating and cooling) and door panels. In russia, you can get cloth seats even with the best package! I was there yesterday…

i forgot, there is no cloth seat manufactured straight from lexus. No dealer orders the car with it. If you want a cloth interior, you have to go to lexus, and have them order one for you….which I think is REALLY dumb!

Not sure what you looked at. In looking at Edmunds comparison they also state it has a cloth interior standard. The Lexus website also does not state leather is standard. $2400 sure seems to be a lot of money for heated/cooled seats and a different wood so I would hope it includes a leather upgrade from cloth also.

http://www.lexus.com/lexusConfigApp/pub/standardFeatures.do

Seating ………………ES 350 LaCrosse
Total Seating Capacity 5 5
Front Seat Type bucket bucket
Upholstery Type cloth premium leather

The people that post 5 paragraph responses to NOFGM are just as ignorant as he is. The nonsense spouted by GM haters is astonishing. YOu people are so poorly informed that its embarrasing. Now we are told that the Japanese are responsible for the quality cars we have today. Who taught the Japanese how to do that after WW2? An American you idiots. The US forced Gm and Ford out of Japan after WW2 to allow the local automakers to get a foothold and Americans taught them how to manufacturer cars in a lean and high quality manner.

The ES350 has NEVER come with standard leather seats.

“I do have a nit to pick at this car though! When I drove this, a couple of months ago, There were something that felt really nice, and some things that were really really cheap! It’s in the places where you won’t look or touch too often….which, to me, feels like they cut corners.”

care to name specifics? I drove the car and found NOTHING cheap about the inside. Niether have the professional reviewers.

“I’m pretty sure I said this before, but I’ll say it again. I will wait for a year or two for real reviews. GM is known for having problems with their new remodel year vehicles.”

Its not just GM. Edmunds has had numerous problems with its long term GT-R and their 370Z busted its transmission and had to be towed. There is myth and there is reality. Oh yeah, they also had a Fit that busted it’s reverse gear and had to be towed. Apparently something in the gearbox wasn’t bolted in correctly and the part detached.

“Buick; because we didn’t think we’d be able to sell it.”

“Buick, you already paid for most of it.”
“Buick, because your mortgage is just too damn expensive.”
“Buick, well, it’s BIGGER than the competition at least.”
“Buick, now includes one free vote for Obama ‘12″

yo, that was hilarious stuff armstealer! Great material.

Taking one of my old bits, eh?
Pretty cool!

How about:
“Buick, Tiger can do better, but you can’t, right?
“Buick, for when you’ve almost arrived, sort of”
“Buick, tired of luxury car treatment and luxurious service? Come on in, jerk!”
“Buick, thank you sir, may I have another?”
“Buick, on the cutting edge of mediocre”
“Buick, that money-back thing is still on, right?”
“Buick, this is where you get the $1.49 gas, yeah”

I actually like this car, but…………I can’t help it
It’s too easy!
DrFill

BTW, if we are comparing apples to apples
The 2010 Lexus ES350 has leather STANDARD
(New change mid-gen update)

So much for the price advantage for the LaCrosse
I had it at $2750, comparably equipped, using a 2009 Lexus ES
Now the difference is closer to $1k

Factor in Lexus’ free scheduled maintenance, better fuel economy, and much better resale, and you will pay MORE for the Buick
Nice!
DrFill

If you have to pay extra for leather seats, I dont call it a luxury car.

nmofgm

If ”Buick is the king of Luxury” then what is Cadillac? The queen? or servant?

___________________________________________________________

I just sat in an enclave and was really disappointed. The plastic was hard in about 80% of spaces. I could even see cracks between the panels where they come together. 3rd row seat is cramped and claustrophobic probably for even 12-year-olds. The tracks where the rear seats slid back and forth were exposed and ugly. Not to mention that if you have kids, all kinds of gunk will get stuck in there. And the seats were really, really stiff.

However —

The ride quality was nice, no rattles, and minimal road noise.

Still, I think in my opinion that my 01 MDX is nicer.

_____________________________________________________________________________

”That new Lacrosse will not only trounce Audi A4 and A6 into the ground in sales, performance, class and quality, it isn’t a total embarrassment to own like a POS from Germany” — nmofgm

The A6? What??

Gee what has this world come to.

Pretty soon (according to nmofgm) Chevrolet Cobalt LSes will be on par with a bentley

i just drove the lacrosse earlier today. outstanding car, had a quieter ride over the lincoln mkz and a sportier ride over the lexus es. very nice car, but the joke a saleman reminded me of the local lexus dealer. he wanted me look at the lucerne and knew very liitle about the lacrosse. he was trying to sell me something they had a large supply of while i had no intrest in the old school lucerne.
the lacrosse seems to be in the big leagues while the dealers are like a toyota or mazda brands.

Except Toyota dealers sell their cars
DrFill

I think it’s a great looking car. Maybe it’s time that ‘we’ stopped living in the past and judged all NEW cars for what THEY are. The new LaCrosse [Allure in Canada] is the best Buick in decades. I’d say that’s rather promising. I sure wouldn’t be be embarrassed to own one. My ONLY concern is resale value – but in time – that will improve too.

CanadaCraig,
I agree with you!… except for the first sentence

i cant judge the quality of the car pictured, but as for deisgns… marketing at GM must not have had THIS car in mind when they said the design was class-leading or whatever… actually, i find it amazing how the managed to ruin the decent design of opels insignia into this meaningless rebadge face…

Companies often use the prestige brands for comparison, without being close rivals in reality. Over the years there have always been the “poor mans Mercedes” or BMW. The Buick will sell for less, despite what the sticker is and it should represent a pretty good value in these days of a 35,000.00 Taurus. I’m sure Lincoln is using Lexus for comparison for their gussied up Focus and do not compare it to a Buick or Chrysler. Imperials for years had a niche but never dethroned Cadillac or Mercedes, etc. but they obviously Chrysler made some money on them over a New Yorker and it satisfied the Chrysler faithful. The new GM offerings are certainly not buisness as ususal, the Malibu has been well recieved. The models like the Enclave and Acadia are more than different grills like the past. Common engines, transmissions and platforms are across the board in the auto industry. GM needed to go bankrupt to hopefully see the old buisness model didn’t work anymore. I would never consider a Lexus even thought it is a great car. My money needs to work harder for me but I would still like a car that is less pedestrian than a Cobalt. The LaCrosse has it’s place in the GM fold. People talk about it being an old mans car but so was Cadillac until the CTS hit the road and it certainly has revitalized Cadillac even though many will bash it. People will vote with sales, the CTS and Malibus are common sights on the roads. Lets hope for auto industry that people do want to buy American auto’s and not just Japanese, Korean and European cars.

I guess that cinches it – 1115 has to be dead. No way he’d let this article pass without comment… Wouldn’t it be ironic if it was the air bag schrapnel that did him in?

Need More Oil For GM is probably one of the smartest people on this site. The guy just posts the same stuff over and over and manages to get 75% of your panties all into a wad. But you fall for it every time. The guy obviously hates General Motors more than anyone here.

Am I missing something? I know I don’t post a lot, but I read the articles every day… Is it not obvious to you? Sure it’s good fun to argue with someone who’s pretending to have the mental capacity of a 5 year old once or twice, but after all this time I can’t believe people are still arguing with this guy!

But anyway, (insert nursing home/geriatric/old people joke here) Buick blows.