Comments on: California sues GM, Ford, Honda, Chrysler, Toyota, Nissan

By: Jaralaccs

Jaralaccs — Sun, 24 Sep 2006 01:25:46 +0000

so what kind of car does Attorney General Bill Lockyer drive that he doesn’t contribute to the very thing he’s sueing for?

By: Fatstrat

Fatstrat — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 22:20:36 +0000

And believe me, the older you get the more stupid you think you were when you were younger.
42 here, and boy was I dumb when i was 17-20. LOL.

By: dalemf

dalemf — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 21:06:50 +0000

LamboZ — what are you talking about? You guys always take everything to extreme. I mention one thing about how you see things differently when you get older — not better, just differently, and you realize you weren’t all that smart when you were young — and I suddenly have senior’s tunnelvision (I’m only 44). It’s impossible to have intelligent conversation when people jump to conclusions and add thoughts and ideas that weren’t offered. You think I’m supposed to have that attitude because of your stereotype of Christians, not because of what I’ve said. Like Fatstrat said, I’m not perfect, just forgiven. In fact, to be a Christian means to admit you’re a big-time screw up. I KNOW I’m not perfect and DON’T know everything. But I have opinions, and last time I checked, I can still do that.

By: LamborghiniZ

LamborghiniZ — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 20:43:34 +0000

and yes fatstart, cars indeed. cars provides almost as heated a discussion as religion. maybe more.

By: LamborghiniZ

LamborghiniZ — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 20:42:20 +0000

YourNameHere, you’re right. dalemf, you’ve got tunnelvision, you believe that you’re so called “senority” enables you to understand life/the world around us better than others. It doesn’t. What you’re saying is illogical, you comfort yourself with religion and God because there are questions in life you don’t have the answer to, so of course, God and religion are there to give you the “”"answers”"”. Nothing necessarily wrong with that, millions, no let me restate that, billions of people do the same thing, every single day. But don’t for a second let that give you the idea that you somehow understand things better than everyone else does, because it clearly doesn’t.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 20:15:39 +0000

appreciate the respect…though i think the actual topic of this thread died back around post 50 or so haha

By: Fatstrat

Fatstrat — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 19:57:02 +0000

YNH, what I have found time and time again is that folks who have accepted Christ commenting on how it was like putting on eyeglasses with proper prescription after years of having it wrong. They say they saw everything much more clearly after. But in any case, I am not perfect so I will screw up now and again (’not perfect, just forgiven’)but I don’t want to make any enemies. I respect your personal decision even though I don’t agree with it.
I would just reccomend some research and just ask God to show you.
You don’t believe He exists, so what can it hurt?
thanks for the lively exchange.
now, back to cars.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 19:16:56 +0000

and i didnt insult your person. we were talking about religion. both sides of the belief line were crossed. but you crossed into the personal level. that was un called for.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 19:15:07 +0000

dalemf- what happened was we stopped talking about religion and started insulting me…not what i said i was going to discuss. do what you gotta do. its your life. you know if what your doing is the right thing for you. it feels right. if i felt like i needed to go to church i would go (like i said earlier i dont label myself, it limits what you see) but right now to me, religion makes no sence. i feel my energy/time can be better used somewhere else.

By: dalemf

dalemf — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 19:10:38 +0000

“your right, im young. lots of energy. i can keep going as long as ya want.” What happened to that? I heard a lot of crossing the line about Christians earlier. Again, though, that’s OK, right?

Bye.

By: Fatstrat

Fatstrat — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 19:07:51 +0000

Point taken.
But from an intellectually honest perspective, one wouldnt know if ‘it’ worked for them unless they tried ‘it’.
People can do what ever they want spiritually, Christians are motivated by the fact that the Word of God tells them to have compassion for non-believers. If I saw you standing on rail road tracks and there was a train coming that you didnt see i would tell you about it. Same thing.
But, no one should insult/harass or demean you for making the decision you are making. Just be sure you are making it from and educated point of view for your sake and the sake of any children you may have influence over.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 19:01:48 +0000

ps. im done with this converstation. when you corss the line of talking about a concept we disagree on to insulting me as a person it goes to far. have a good life doing what ya gotta do to get by.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 18:56:31 +0000

ill give ya a little background…im 21, graduated college have a full time, design tshirts for a large sports apparel company, bought a brand new car at 20, my gf has a child (not mine by blood by there is alot more to being a father then blood) i raised my bro and sis more then most siblings do. i far more responsible then most my age. don’t try to insult my intelligence/responsibility because i like to play video games a sleep in. there are far to many questionable things in any religion for me to believe in them. a couple ppl on an internet message board are not going to convince me to do anything. if it works for you and helps you get through your day and makes you feel good then go for it. but it doesn’t work for me…

By: dalemf

dalemf — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 18:43:40 +0000

I was just as sure as you when I was your age that I knew everything, too. And you know what? When you grow up, have kids, get a job and really start to see how these things affect your life and your family’s, you realize just how stupid you were when you were young.

By: dalemf

dalemf — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 18:38:17 +0000

It’s silly to equate old time cowboy movies to video games that young people like you can play for hours at a time. There is a far, far greater strain on one’s psychological well-being through continuous, day after day, hour after hour play where the player is lost to the world around them and actually commiting the violence in the game than any old time cowboy movie — before the days of video and cable TV — a kid would see once. There is more involved in the game, and as an avid player, you would have to admit that. But, considering your age and your not-so-admirable go-get ‘em attitude of sleeping in and playing games, maybe you can’t figure these things out yet.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 18:38:15 +0000

or maybe everyone just got tired of arguing…your right, im young. lots of energy. i can keep going as long as ya want. and i have had this argument with many ppl, and haven’t been turned onto god or religion. in fact it turns me off even more. i dont label myself as a republican democrat liberal or conservative. doing so instantly limits your ability to see/hear an issue and deal with it unbiased. i dont think any one group/book/person/god/cheeseburger has all the answer, im not going to support conservatives that wont let gays marries but i support video game/music/tv warning labels 110%. maybe if you take off your “Bible Blinders” and look at everyone’s opinion you might see what im talking about. PS, save your prayers, they don’t mean anything to me and im sure your time can be better spent.

By: Fatstrat

Fatstrat — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 18:29:54 +0000

Ok Scott Sylvainus.
Still, now one is or ever has tried to take your video games away from you. Like I said before, Tipper and Algore managed to get music and games and such labeled to help parents and to limit what kids could get without parental approval. Seems reasonable doesnt it?
And you really should do a little research into the worlds religions and Christianity. You might learn something.
I reccomended before ‘Evidence That Demands a Verdict’ by Josh Mcdowell.
After all, it is an important issue, and I would rather be me than you if I happened to be wrong.
In any case, you can still be a Christian and play video games and sleep in on sunday mornings. no rules againt that.

By: dalemf

dalemf — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 18:23:35 +0000

You’re obviously pretty young then, and I really don’t know what you’re talking about with half your statements. No one said anything new had to be done about video games. You were the one complaining, and since the warning labels are the only thing that has ever been done about video games, I assumed you didn’t like that. And absolutely it’s the parents responsibility. You sound like a conservative there; maybe you should support Republican efforts for tort reform to get rid of all the frivolous lawsuits — like this CA suit. And no, you don’t have to be a Christian to treat people with respect — whoever said you did? What an idiotic thing to say or believe. You keep throwing things in here that no one has talked about. And if we can never change anyone’s mind about religion, why do so many people — like myself — go from not belieiving in God to following Christ and accepting him as our Lord and Saviour? God’s calling is far stronger than your power to resist. We’re the last two even talking on this topic, so maybe this entire blog has been used by Him as a way to open your eyes to your need for Him. He works like that, you know. I will keep you in my prayers, young man.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 18:03:21 +0000

edit- for the violent games = violent future agrument to hold any water i need to be shown the child wouldn’t have done the violent actions with out the games and that the games is what caused the child to do it. one could argue that the violent nature of the child is what drew him to the game in the 1st place.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 18:00:44 +0000

PS: in the 60s & 70s cowboys and Indians where big. lots of movies and tv shows and what not. my father tells me all the time there was the same arguments when he was a kid. kids playing cowboys and Indians were going to grow up and rob banks and kill ppl. my dad played, he is a responsible adult. owns his own company. and has never broken the law more then a speeding ticket. For the video games = violent future argument to hold any water I need proof that the child wouldn’t have done the violent action with out the video games. there has been violence since day one. Its animal. Its primal. Its not electronic.
– SCOTT SYLVAINUS –

By: dalemf

dalemf — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 17:17:26 +0000

Your Name Here — You must really be worried about your video games, because you keep coming back to it and no one else is talking about it. But, what if a young boy keeps playing a violent video game and then goes out and acts it out in real life? Doesn’t society have a duty to try and prevent that — not by banning your precious games, but by at least informing parents of what those games contain? And yes, there are a lot of religions. No, they are not all right. There have been 1000s of false gods worshipped, but there is only one true God, and the evidence for it is all around us. That’s my belief. And this will shock you — you are perfectly entitled to your belief. But if sleeping in on Sundays and playing video games is what matters most to you, I’m just going to have to start praying for you.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 16:56:27 +0000

my biggest problem with religion is that there are to many. Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhist and countless others. how can all of them be right? are any of them right? what if the “right” religion died 45,000 years ago and no one has ever practiced it in modern times. what if…oh no…Islam is the right religion?! and because of this war all the Christians will be going to hell for going against Muhammad! and what about the Greek/roman belief of the gods? how childish does it sound that ppl believed there was a mountain with gods that controlled every part of human life? it sounds like a cartoon. and i don’t think there is any educated person today that believes this to be true…yet millions of people believe that there is being that looks down on use from heaven and decided what to do with us?! i cant wait, in 2000yrs kids in a class room will be learning about our time period and laugh because we believed in ‘god’ then again…maybe im wrong and ill die and go to hell…or maybe ill just rot in the ground. Until the day I find out the answer im going to enjoy my Sunday mornings by sleeping in.

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 16:47:50 +0000

if your life is right for you then live it. dont make others do what you think is right. thats why we have FREEDOMS…so we can pick what we want to do. you want to play a violent game go for, if you dont then…dont. but if i want to play grand theft auto and killer a hooker there you have no right to stop me.

By: Fatstrat

Fatstrat — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 14:50:40 +0000

First, the basis of your fears seems to be rooted in sexual addictions. You fear losing access to pornography. Uh, thats funny since its in every grocery store on on practically every street corner and freely piped into your living room 24/7. Hope thats not too difficult for you to get. And you don’t like the fact that gays cannot marry as hetro’s do, which is really just a semantic issue as gays have all the rights and then some under the law that heteros do. They just cant use the word ‘married’. Marriage defined is between people of the opposite sex. Gays want to re-define it. What is wrong with heteros wanting its definition to stay traditional? Gays lose nothing but a title therefore many people (even non-religious people) see it as an attack on what the traditional definition of marriage is.
But this is really just a side bar to the main point.
Corporate Evangelical Christianity is nothing like what you attemp to characterize it as here. The church wants to protect children and families. It is a proven FACT that you cannot argue with any kind of intellectual honesty that pornography is destructive to both. The church would probably like to see it go away, but is realistic in its views and SUPPORTIVE OF THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES and is not trying to ban it. When you make this claim, you are lying plain and simple. What the church does, is to try to educate that is is not a beneficial pursuit for obvious reasons.
Abortion? no one can prove scientifically when life begins all there are are theories. Why not err on the side of life? rather than possibly take one in the name of convenience?
Now you say you have no problem with someone who wants to have sex with a cow in the privacy of their own home. Look what incrimentalism has done to us. If you have no problem with that then you should see, not a priest but probably a doctor first.
I predict that in 20 years, beastiality will be as accepted as homosexuality is today do to the previously mentioned incrimentalism.
To compare the bible/Christianity to fairytales is such an imbicilic effort that it hardly bears responding to. The bible has been shown to be exact in geographical and historical content even by those who do not accept it as being Gods Word. No one is forcing you to believe it, no one is going to cut your head off with a rusty knife for not accepting it or speaking out against it nor will you lose your head over making assinine comments about it like you have here.
Too much to comment on here.
The subjects are worthy of debate. But you are just not making a case here.

By: dalemf

dalemf — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 14:33:35 +0000

So, someone decided it wasn’t morally right to have sex with minors, so they passed a law? Someone decided it wasn’t morally right to have sex with dead people, so they passed a law? How dare these people legislate what others can and can’t do — I mean, what if someone has a genetic disposition to be attracted to those young children. Society is denying his rights? I’m shocked. And learn your law, smart guy. In most states, a woman can have an abortion at any time during her pregnancy. And I guess the whole “right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness” only applies if your mom is in a good place in her life, or a good neighborhood? How many remarkable and important people in history were born in the ghettos and battled neighborhoods of crime and drugs to become important and historic? How many more were killed before they even had the chance because of convenience? Oh, and I guess that child I’ve referred to wanting to pray before a meal — silently and to herself — it’s OK to legislate against her rights? And since you’re so obsessed with homsexuality — far more than me since I’ve said very little about it: you want to be gay, fine. No problem. You want to live with another guy? Fine, do it. No problem. You want to pretend you’re married? Go for it, I won’t stop you — nor would most Christians. We wouldn’t agree with it, but we would never try to stop you. But I don’t see why we — as a society — have to be forced into legally accepting your lifestyle. We don’t legally allow people to be married to multiple people. Should we change that, too? You people like to throw around the word hypocrite. Well, try it on and see how you like it because there’s nothing more hypocritical than a liberal saying they respect a religious person’s beliefs. Let me see if I can use your own words — “i will respect your beliefs (homosexuality) so long as you don’t try to push them onto me (Like trying to pass laws against abortions {for partial birth abortion}, or banning gay marriage {legalizing gay marriage}, or taking video games off selves {limiting my freedom of religious rights}) in return i would expect you to respect me beliefs.” There, how’s that work?

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 12:10:43 +0000

your examples of sex with children are misplaced. there are laws against that in every state. also you cant have an abortion after a certain time in the pregnancy so a 9mon old would never be aborted. and you cant have sex with dead ppl either. No one is saying you HAVE to be gay, or you HAVE to abort your child. so who are you to say other ppl cant? you may not have passed any laws but ill be damned if you aren’t trying. What if the mother was raped? or she isn’t in a stable environment and wouldn’t be able to raise the child well? would you rather she had the baby and raised it in a crappy place rather then wait a few years and do it right? And if you say will that’s diff, then who makes the decision of when a abortion is legal? Isn’t it the mother body? and what effect does it have on you if two guys or two girls want to get married? at most you may be a little uncomfortable if you see them at the mall. wake up…it’s a case of “your welcome to have an opinion as long as its the one i have” dalemf…tell me how a gay couple effect you? why cant a gay couple get married? it comes back to what i said earlier…i will respect your beliefs so long as you don’t try to push them onto me (Like trying to pass laws against abortions, or banning gay marriage, or taking video games off selves) in return i would expect you to respect me beliefs.

By: dalemf

dalemf — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 03:51:43 +0000

Random Jerk — what about the rights of the unborn child? You won’t dare consider that, will you? Leftists would be quick to protect the life of an unborn seal, but a human child can have his brains sucked out. What’s the difference between a 9 month old in the womb and a baby one day old after birth? None, yet one can be killed and the other can’t. And what if the 5 year old gives permission to have sex, or a 12 year old, or a 15 year old? Is it OK to have sex with them then? Or what about dead people — can’t harm their rights then, right. So sex with them would be OK? And you continue to amuse me by saying that I’ve listed a plan of attack against your freedoms when I certainly have not. Again, they are examples of liberal influence in society, and if you can’t understand that, maybe I have to rethink the whole evolution thing afterall. And I will accept your refusal to list examples of how we’ve taken your freedoms away as admission by you that we haven’t.

By: Random Jerk

Random Jerk — Fri, 22 Sep 2006 00:20:08 +0000

Again, you listed many of the assaults on my freedom for me. You draw a distinction between the goals of the religious right and what they’ve actually acomplished. I draw NO such distinction. An attack on my freedom is attack, successful or not. Are my concearns only valid after you’ve struck down my freedom?

“What if I think it’s OK to kill a baby after 1 year — you know, test him out, see if I like him? What if I think it’s OK to have sex with 5 year olds? What if I think it’s OK to own a slave?”

All of these things violate the freedom of others. Specifically the rights of the 1 year old, the 5 year old, and the slave. Your freedom ends when it encroaches upon the freedom of others. Just like it ends when when you attempt to apply your morality wholesale to the rest of society.

“What if I think it’s OK to have sex with a cow in public?”

I personally would not have a problem with the actual act, (unlike you, I would assume) but for health and sanitation reasons I wouldn’t be against a (local level government) ban for this in public places.

“let everyone do whatever they want, society be damned, sink as far as we can sink, and live in moral anarcy”

Yea yea, I heard it a million times, without a bible derived moral code and the threat of eternal burning in hell, man would be amoral and have no reason to be plesent to his fellow man. I don’t buy that line of “reasoning” one bit, but it seems to be a really popular argument. Is the fear of punishment (or lack of reward for the I’m going to heaven types) the only reason you’re moral?

By: MiracleGro

MiracleGro — Thu, 21 Sep 2006 23:39:46 +0000

No Dale you cant be extreme because being gay is not the same as having sex with 5 year olds and cows and you know it. you just don’t like gay people.

Allowing gay marriage is giving all americans EQUAL rights and is not going down the drain pipe. nor is it moral anarchy, you know you are being dishonest

Why not just be honest and say ” I want to deny some Americans the same rights that I enjoy”?

Be a man say it

By: dalemf

dalemf — Thu, 21 Sep 2006 22:26:15 +0000

Random Jerk/Jimbo, et al–Again, you refuse to read, and you refuse to answer my question. How has Christian influence in America affected your freedoms? What has been taken from you? Not might. Not want to. What have we done?? How are you less free? Whereas I stated clearly how the left HAS affected my rights and made me — and YOU — less free. You people all start with the typical reactionary hate speech and conclusion jumping. Did I ever say that anyone’s freedom should be taken away? NO! Again, read! I didn’t say anything about TV programs being banned, abortion being banned, homesexuality being banned. I stated those as examples of liberal influence being in control, and not Christian influence which so many of you are afraid of — and which got me started on this. And let’s see if I can be extreme to make a point. What if I think it’s OK to kill a baby after 1 year — you know, test him out, see if I like him? What if I think it’s OK to have sex with 5 year olds? What if I think it’s OK to own a slave? What if I think it’s OK to have sex with a cow in public? My choice, my freedom to live like I want. Can I, or would you and civilization have a problem with that? Would that disgust you? Would you be happy if it were allowed? Let’s just continue down the drain pipe, let everyone do whatever they want, society be damned, sink as far as we can sink, and live in moral anarcy. Sounds like a great plan. By the way, I’m still waiting for your examples of what we’ve done to make you less free?

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Thu, 21 Sep 2006 21:52:15 +0000

Fatstrat- there is lawsuit right now in FLA about a game called “Bully”. the big hubbub is that walmart.com was pre-ordering the game before it had a rating. What 7ryr old kid has a credit card to buy the game! mom and dad got it for them. there for it is the parents fault. not the game company. that little johnny is exposed to the violence. (by the way the layer for this suit is backed by a Christian group) i dont feel like going into more detail. you do the research if you want. i think Random Jerk has hit the nail right on the head with his post. you dont HAVE to be gay, or get an abortion or watch violent movies. you want to take away MY freedom to do so because YOU dont think its right. well then i think if our going to believe in “god” you must also believe in santa clause because they both have as much base in truth. see, im sure you didnt like that. so what makes you think i want to hear your opinion, frankly i dont give a damn. i havnt been to church since i was 4, i believe in evolution and i had sex and im not married yet. im still standing. it all comes down to what i said 1st. you dont force your beliefs on me and we wont have any problems. ppl for gay marrage arnt saying you have to turn gay…they just want to get married. so why do you have the right to say they cant marry?

By: YourNameHere

YourNameHere — Thu, 21 Sep 2006 21:52:15 +0000

By: Andre Neves

Andre Neves — Thu, 21 Sep 2006 21:37:06 +0000

Funny, since the Governor Arnold schwartsnihige.e…however you spell it, drives the most polluting, most inefficient vehicle out there, the Hummer.

By: Andre Neves

Andre Neves — Thu, 21 Sep 2006 21:31:57 +0000

This is so stupid. I bet 80% of the vehicles which are used in law enforcement are Ford Crown Vics. Aren’t they contridicting themselves?

By: MiracleGro

MiracleGro — Thu, 21 Sep 2006 21:21:53 +0000

I’m with Random Jerk all the way on this one.