Of course the Enclave is stealing sales from the Outlook. The Enclave has a beautiful, distinctive design while the Outlook appears to be a dowdier version of the blocky Acadia. While GMC’s version of this vehicle features brand appropriate styling, the Outlook should have been given sleeker, sexier sheetmetal. The Outlook really doesn’t represent Saturn’s Eurocentric Opel-derived design philosophy very well and offers nothing to lure buyers away from the Enclave (or the Acadia for that matter).

I also expect the Malibu to start cannibalizing Aura sales. The Aura is attractive enough, but doesn’t offer anything special to lure buyers away from purchasing a Malibu (except current availability, but that will change soon). The Malibu has the added bonus of a being supported by a major advertising push to announce its arrival in the market.

Oh baby. There you go 1115

I’m a fan of the new CTS,but kind of out of my price range…GM has gotten better lately, the malibu doesn’t seem too bad, but I haven’t driven one yet. time will tell if this car is successful or not

500 was an awfully low guesstimate.

The new Chevys are a huge improvement over the past generation. I got an 07 Tahoe LTZ the thing is by far the best big SUV I’ve ever owned. 20k miles, not a single problem, not a rattle. So far I’m very impressed. The Malibu looks great and really is a nice alternative to the japanese counterparts.

Not bad GM.

Nearly 5000 dealers and only 500 expected sales?? Wow…these expectations are from leaders?? Where do they get they’re numbers from? Best looking car from Chevy for a loooonnnnggg time and it should be sold out for months…then rental cars and big rebates within 6 months…now thats a sales forcast!

That is certainly good news for GM, they are on the right track, let’s hope they keep it up. I too am surprised by the amount of Enclaves I see here in the Midwest being driven by younger people.

Hmm is this outselling the Accord ? Is it outselling the Camry ?
Its outselling the last Malibu and the Sebring and Fusion
Is the Enclave outselling the Pilot ? Will it have a higher resale
Its outselling the Rendezvous and the Ranier
Way to go GM
Remember the 300 C and Charger sold well when they first came out but look what happened
Im not impressed at all Its just a GM

People, relax. This car is just hitting dealerships. The higher than expected numbers could signify a better than expected distribution cycle. But it could also be that this is the hottest sedan on the market…

This car is showing GM is trying hard. The new malibu does have a more quality look and feel and is definately close to the level of sophistication you get with European and Asian cars. But what I hate about this car the most is that Chevy symbol. It has become a symbol of white trash redneck culture. I always picture a guy in a wife beater and a stained baseball cap saying “chevy power” I think GM needs to reinvent the image of Chevy and update the emblem to give it a higher status image. But as promising as this car sounds, I doubt very much it will run smooth and flawless after 10 years with 150k on in. And the resale value of these things will be low. Its probably best to buy a 6month-1 year old model and save almost 1/4 of the original price.

they probably expect 500 as its the first month of sales and not many people may have had it figured into their new car searching eyes yet, apparently they do

But since someone brought it up… It seems to me that in 3 years the Chevy will be covered under a factory warranty, the Accord and Camry will not. Which one will be worth more?

True about the Outlook. I see a decent amount of Enclaves and Acadias, but barely ANY Outlooks.

Toyota and Honda are always worth more on the used car market. Even the mighty Cadillac is a time bomb with horrible resale value.

GM will make the 3 year gap close IF they put quality parts under all those pretty surfaces.

If GM has screwed buyers again then they will pay, possibly with their corporate life.

How about a Malibu coupe? I could see even more sales, now that Honda’s great-looking Accord coupe is doing well, as well as Nissan’s Altima coupe. Both go to show you that people want 2-doors as well as 4-doors. I think the Malibu should be offered in a coupe body style as well, especially now that the Monte Carlo is gone.

“Toyota and Honda are always worth more on the used car market” – while the book shows this is true, we’re talking about a new ball game with GM offering the 5 year / 100,000 mile powertrain warranty on all 2007 vehicles. That, combined with a reduction in sales to the rental fleet should change things considerably. Toyota is actually increasing their sales to those fleets, BTW. It will be interesting how this plays out.

Times are slowly a changing.

Good news, though I think that original 500 target was way too low. This is closer to what I personally expected for the Malibu. Expanding to Orion is a big DUH, there should be way more Malibus available than there are right now considering the way GM is pushing it. It’s a great car, but if there are none around who gives a ****?

As for reliability, I think many who are wary about GM will be very surprised, at least when it comes to the 2.4L+6AT and 3.6L+6AT powertrains. The Ecotecs have always been very reliable, and the 3.6L V6 is showing to be that way as well. I actually have the 3.6L+6AT powertrain that will be in the LTZ, and it’s very nice. Smooth, impressively powerful, and doesn’t have that feeling of imminent doom that plagued 90s domestic cars.

Once I knew I was buying GM, the first thing I ruled out was anything with a 4-speed automatic. Aside from the high-torque version that’s in many trucks and was in the GTO, GM’s 4-speeds need to go. That’s why Chevy can’t bring the 6-speed automatic to the Ecotec engine soon enough. If they rely on the ancient 4-speed to carry most of the Malibu volume, that will show in reduced customer satisfaction. With Toyota and Honda offering 5-speeds with their 4-cylinder models, GM *needs* to get the 6-speed rolling. That will ensure the Malibu is a far superior offering to 4-banger Camrys and Accords, regardless of whatever people’s opinions may be on the 6-cylinder variants. I prefer GM’s Ecotec engines, but unfortunately GM has a tendency to hold content from their 4-cylinder models like in the G6. GM needs to abandon that line of thinking ASAP.

The latest Japanese mid-size cars produce more on-paper horsepower than the 3.6L’s 252hp, but they don’t seem to meet those numbers in the real world, producing 6.1s and 6.2s in lighter bodies while the Aura XR and G6 GTP make 5.9s at 3600lbs.

The previous Malibu was unarguably a straight-to-rental car. The only one I liked was the quirky Maxx SS, which shouldn’t have been called an SS but was still kinda cool anyway.

I can see a Malibu coupe being offered. It makes sense, as the G6 was easily developed into a 2-door. Also, I doubt the Monte Carlo will be returning anytime soon, as it was a FWD farce of a great nameplate that sold poorly, so the door is open.

A Malibu coupe will cannabalize G6 sales and only further destroy the resale values of the Sedans. Although you’re bang on with the 4 speed transmission.

True. Unfortunately, with GM’s affinity for trying to make Chevy, Pontiac, and Saturn all the same brand overlap is inevitable. And finding a strategy that would keep all 3 brands relevant without them having similar products is almost impossible.

Hopefully GM will follow through with giving Pontiac its own RWD lineup. History, though, says GM will just end up rebadging those to Chevy and Saturn anyway, and we’ll be stuck where we started.

If it wasn’t for Saturn’s loyal customer base, I’d say kill it and operate on a Chevy=FWD (mostly) Pontiac=RWD basis.

CA36GTP: “GM has a tendency to hold content from their 4-cylinder models like in the G6″ Actually, that is the dealer body doing that. Pontiac has a 1SV package with limited content at a bargain basement price, but you could order a 4 cyl G6 sedan with a sunroof.

Other than the opinion about the 4 speed trannys, I can’t argue with any of your points…

I know about the two different base G6s, but even with the higher-content model, you can’t get everything. Powertrain choice should have nothing to do with option availability.

For example, I’m pretty sure there’s no way to get leather in a 2.4L G6.

Actually, leather is available on a 4 cyl G6. MSRP fully loaded would be $22,060

Hrm, well it’s not on Pontiac’s website, which is not a dealership. If it is available, it’s clearly being hidden well. Honda wouldn’t do the same thing.

I applaud any good news from Detroit. And I agree with rms492 in that the timing for a well executed coupe based on the Malibu is pretty good; just don’t call it the Monte Carlo. ‘Malibu Coupe’ has a nice ring to it and 2 door Malibus have some history of their own.

How can you expect the Malibu to outsell the Camcord when it JUST came out. Maybe eventually it will

I just checked Pontiac’s website, and I agree that building a car there sucks. I guess they’re not ready to cut the dealers out completely!

Mazdaman: The Outlook and Acadia should not both exist.

“GM originally expected younger buyers to opt of the Outlook, but many are choosing the Enclave instead.”

That’s me. I’d never have imagined myself in a Buick! Lot of old people in my exurb, and many of them drive Buicks. But not cool ones!

Lutz: “It just shows you how the best laid plans go awry.” I don’t think “awry” is what’s happening here.

mazdaman: “The Enclave has a beautiful, distinctive design while the Outlook appears to be a dowdier version of the blocky Acadia.”
I agree.

The Malibu looks like a concept car.

Maximus “time will tell if this car is successful or not.” Yep.

Wickedated: my mom also has an ‘07 Tahoe LTZ. Her only problem is the bad neighbor kids ripping off the windshield wipers. She’s moved now.

1115: “Is the Enclave outselling the Pilot ?” Who knows? “Will it have a higher resale?” Yes.

“Im (sic) not impressed at all.”
You’re only impressed when a porn star puts peppermint oil on himself before you service him.

planet_drive: rednecks prefer Ford trucks. Which I find ironic, because H. Ford said he’d pay blacks and whites the same.

“I doubt very much it will run smooth and flawless after 10 years with 150k on it.” My experience tells me differently.”

raiv: “It seems to me that in 3 years the Chevy will be covered under a factory warranty, the Accord and Camry will not. Which one will be worth more?” good point.

Get Real: “Even the mighty Cadillac is a time bomb with horrible resale value.” That’s possible if gas goes up to $4 and Escalade sales skew the brand. But again, resale value is theoretical at best.

rms492: I like the Altima coupe.

CA36: “If it wasn’t for Saturn’s loyal customer base, I’d say kill it and operate on a Chevy=FWD (mostly) Pontiac=RWD basis. I’m almost OK with that. Let’s make Saturn the home for rebadged Opels, and kill the Outlook.

Acadia’s price should be dropped slightly and the Outlook killed. That way Acadia will draw in most lower-budget buyers and the Enclave’s higher point will still be preserved. It’s not like GM doesn’t make a good profit on the Lambdas as is.

If it hasnt outsold the Accord and the Camry then what are you jack asses so excited about ?
Wow! It outsold the old Malibu and the expectations were set so low bc of its track record that they went over
JJT whatever you do with Lamboz when you are not posting on LLN is your business

If JJT and I knew one another we would probably just hunt you down and give you a tour of the punch factory.
Stupid loser, get your own material. That’s the best you can do?
I bet you get your ass kicked alot at the Jr High.

How is it going to outsell Accord/Camry in a month? That’s one of the dumbest things you’ve ever said.

Northstar Engine = Time Bomb

GM offers no rebuild for it.

When it wears out (sooner for most people it just plain breaks) you get to buy a new motor…or junk your car.

Northstar engines have the same warranty as anything.

another boring GM product. I have to drive one of those things all day, its my job and thats whats issued to me so I don’t care,but to buy one as a personal vehicle never! Hopefully the reliability is greatly improved. Even the police package version has transmission and cooling issues. But you would be surprised how many undercover units are Accords, Altima’s and even a couple of V6 Sonatas. Those are the ones to catch the guys that run.

LOL, what a bunch of crap. So a Sonata is going to run down targets faster than a 5.3L Impala?

I got my brain on hype.
Tonight’ll be your night.
I got this long-assed knife.
And your neck looks just right.
My adrenaline’s pumpin’.
I got my stereo bumpin’.
I’m bout to kill me somethin’. ….

“I have to drive one of those things all day” Errr, no you don’t, at least not unless you got one this month… Cripes, what is 115 playing a cop now?

3000 cars a month is not a goal to cheer about. If anyone wishes to recall 5th grade math (6th grade for those who spend more then 12 years to graduate HS). it is roughly 10% of Camrys sold in this country (not including Canada). This Malibu will be sold only in US market, therefore I share Lutz wild enthusiasm of beating 10% of Camry sales and beating original 500/month quota. I doubt there is a company in the world (including Tata) that would bother building 40,000 copies of car for sale.
Lets give the brand some time. I think the car is OK or excellent for Chevy, but by any stretch imagination it is not a world car. Die hards are buying Chevys build in Mexico and China therefore there is a lot of brand identity, but if this exciting car forum, I would curb enthusiasm for better offerings.

I will say thats much much better GM. It really seems as if GM is getting their stuff together. The only thing i see Toyota doing is making simulators. I wish they were on the grind like gm…..i thought i would never say that.

I am not Toyota biggest fan, and I like Opels (see Malibu), but one month worth of statistic is not a good reason to call each other names and predict either overwhelming success or gloom.

Autonut there’s NEVER a bad time to call each other names, especially with a target as easy as 1115.

Malibu is NOT an Opel. Just because they were handed control of the platform doesn’t make every Epsilon car an Opel.

trooper – hi and welcome moron. This is actually the Malibu thread, not another thread where you can bitch about the Impala. A RWD is coming in 2 years. And I love how you talk about Camcords and Sonatas because those companies don’t make any decent full size cars. Actually, didn’t the new Accord get so bloated now that it is considered a full size rather than mid-size?

autonutt – by “better offerings” I hope you are not reffering to the Camcord because they are not exciting cars either. This is a great car for Chevy, not the greatest car in its class ever made or anything but a HUGE leap from the last one and you have to remember that its only its first month. Only 3500 were built in the first month so even if everyone wanted one, there is no way they could have sold more than what was built—-3500. I think all who want our domestic automakers to make a come back (and I don’t see any reason why you shouldn’t) then we should be happy that Chevy almost sold out ALL the cars it made in its first month. Next month, the Malibu will sell 5000 and then the next month, 8000, and so on and so forth until it reaches maybe 20,000 a month (my prediction) which is respectable. I don’t expect this ‘Bu to beat the Camcord, their fanbase is just too mindlessly loyal, but the next ‘Bu might have a shot at that. Either way, GM is back in the mid size market with a more than decent, ultra competitive car.

Commodore, the Accord is still classified as mid-size, I think. But it’s pretty ****in’ huge.

It’s amazing how regulations have increased the average size of cars. A mid-90s Accord is smaller than most modern compacts.

The Boo will sell the numbers that Commo said but to rental companies.
The Toyota and Honda fanbase are mindlessly loyal ? The Camry and Accord are reliable attractive drive well and built well.
So to have a mind in Commos opinion would be to take a chance on a less reliable car from a company with a track record of making inferior vehicles with poor build quality and low resale value. Not to mention recalls
I guess we should get minds and be Patriots. The should call this the Corsica or the Celebrity oh wait the Lumina
I love the 2007 Buick Rendezvous, Terazza and Ranier btw

You love buicks? You had a common-sense transplant or something?

“So to have a mind in Commos opinion would be to take a chance on a less reliable car from a company with a track record of making inferior vehicles with poor build quality and low resale value.”

No,I think Commodore is suggesting that a Malibu might be a good purchase.

Corsica wasn’t that bad. Celebrity was horrid. By the time the Lumina got its mind right, bad word of mouth had spread

We all know that the Camry is unrealible and the latest version of it has shown itself to be VERY unreliable and has all sorts of problems. Everyone, even its most beloved fans at Consumer Reports, said that it is no longer considered a high quality, reliable car. What is also true is that GM made (I don’t know if you have learned what past tense is yet 1115) unreliable, bad cars under all sorts of names throughout the 80s and early 90s. So here is my logic:

I can’t speak for 1115, but I have enough money to go buy or lease a new car right now. If I am in the midsize sedan market, I have many options, and I can automatically eliminate crap like the Chrysler Sebring. In addition, cars like the Pontiac G6, Ford Fusion, and Hyundai Sonata will also sit sort of low on my list. I am left with the Aura/Malibu, Camcord, and Altima as my best choices. Let’s eliminate the Altima because Nissan is having some reliability issues right now, plus the car is a little on the expensive side and “it’s not Japanese (lmao)”. Now the Camry has been very unreliable lately and has been rating low by the public, by the media, and Toyoda in general has been recalling record numbers of cars these last few years (not in the 80s though). Also, the Camry lost a comparison to the Aura, a car that, unlike the Camry, has been very reliable and has had no problems since it was introduced to the NA market. Now, we don’t know much about the Malibu or the Accord’s reliability because BOTH are brand new cars that don’t really have any reliability data on them yet. However, I feel good choosing the Malibu because it is more bang for the buck and is based on the Aura, and car that has had no reliabilty or quality problems so far. On the other hand, the Accord, although we have no idea about its quality, has a great interior and also has received positive reviews. As a fair, unbiased shopper, that would leave my choices between the Malibu and Accord (or Aura if I want Euro styling).

Now, 1115’s logic is that GM recalled the Corvette because they used the wrong glue on the roof and therefore the Malibu will be unreliable (and so will the Aura – even though it has had no problems, but who cares right? 1115 doesn’t). Therefore, you should pick the Camcord because it is a Japanese vehicle and you are a moron unless you drive Japan. O, and then he finishes by mentioning 2007MY Buick’s to cement his “brilliant” argument as to why nobody should buy a Malibu or Aura.

I took care of our good friend 1115 jackjim
Don’t even worry about it

Commodore, if I were in the midsize sedan market right now, I’d wait until the new Mazda 6 comes out so that my choices are between an Aura, Malibu, and 6. I agree with your narrowing of the choices above to include the Accord, but the new Accord is so dull and putzy looking (sedan version – still haven’t seen a Coupe other than pics) that I just could never choose it. Disagree about the Accord interior though – that dash is dated and hard/plasticky with no real style or life.

If I had to get rid of my GTP for any reason, I’d be looking at the Malibu, Aura, and new Mazda6 like you Ricardo. I’d consider Accord, but I can’t stand the rear end on either the coupe or sedan. Camry doesn’t even register on my radar.

At that point, either the Malibu or Aura would get eliminated depending on what I’m looking for. I really like the Malibu’s exterior, but I like the Aura interior’s styling better. Plus I heard Malibu’s 6-speed is geared differently for economy, and I’d rather have my GTP gearing back in the Aura XR. Malibu is probably built better though. Can’t say what would be my choice. The winner would go up against Mazda6.

Took care of me lol HA
One year of recalls for the Camry is not enough to ruin a 20 year record for quality and reliabiltiy On top of that Toyota acknowledges issues and takes care of them which is something GM could learn Speaking of which you killed CR and said they are unrelibiable but when they killed the Camry you said they were right ? Stay consistent
The Malibu is a good purchase ? Based on what ?
Speaking of the Accord The Accord is proven reliable and you seem to ignore that lol You are so full of ****
Do you know what a track record is ? The Malibu is a rental car and nothing more Sure the new one is better than the old but thats how it should be. There is no solid evidence that the Malibu and the Aura are reliable and they have to PROVE their worth! I dont know how else to say it to you.
The Accord and Camry have high resales values and are the best in class and that doesnt change with one model. The Malibu can turn itself around after two or three models that are reliable and in high demand but it wont happen overnight which is what you are hoping for.
You took care of nothing and neither has GM

Went to the dealer this weekend. Looked at a 2LT 3.6 very well equiped under 25. Did not drive. Looks like a winner all over.
BTW it just got C&D ‘08 10 Best along with 2 other Chevys. Screw off doubters.

Correction-
Along with Vette and CTS.

1115, you cannot use a 1992 or 95 Accord that was reliable to “prove” that a brand new, ALL-new car, is reliable. You cannot do it with the Accord and you cannot do it with the Malibu. You MUST let both cars prove themselves, you cannot just say that the Malibu will be bad and Accord will be good just because you want it that way – you can’t possibly know what will happen. The Accord might turn out to be unreliable and problematic like the current Camry. The Aura has no problems so it has proven itself, SO FAR, to be reliable. And since the Malibu is based on the Aura, it will probably be of similar quality to the Aura – good quality.

The Malibu is not a rental car. The old Malibu – the “Malibu Classic” as GM calls it – will be the car that is sold to rental fleets for now. Very few new Malibus will be sold to fleets. Lastly, I used CR to say that of all the import-humping publications out there that can rate the Camry crap, it was Consumer Reports that did it. It is not about me agreeing with CR – everyone else also rates the Camry badly – I just pointed CR because you used them for “evidence” in the past. Just like when I used KBB in that other post. I use YOUR OWN sources to prove you wrong.

If track record were any true indication, 1115 would be taking it deep up his äss by different guys every night like his mother did for the past 20 years, but 1115 can’t even get laid ….. so their goes his theory right down the toilet along with his dead gerbil.

“not the greatest car in its class ever made or anything.”
yeah, actually, it is (fine print: “excludes other GM products.”)

Everyone, even its most beloved fans at Consumer Reports, said that it is no longer considered a high quality, reliable car. What is also true is that GM made (I don’t know if you have learned what past tense is yet 1115) unreliable, bad cars under all sorts of names throughout the 80s and early 90s. So here is my logic:

Commodore: You don’t get it. The fluffer will never be convinced my rational thought. It has already made up its mind, and will only respond to toyonda babble, no matter how much excrement is included.

RicardoHead: If I were in the midsize-sedan market right now, I’d be choosing among Aura, mazda6 and Dodge Charger, though the latter is not a true commuter coffin.

“the new Accord is so dull and putzy looking.” I yhink it looks nice, but dull is what this category is all about.

CA36GTP: “Camry doesn’t even register on my radar.” Mine, neither. Not even if you put an “L” on the front.

Fluffer One year of recalls for the Camry is not enough to ruin a 20-year record for quality and reliabiltiy.”
You know someone who drives an ‘87 Camry? Thought not.

CR is less stupid than it is biased, fluffer. It’s long been true that you could get a better car (than the Camry) for less, but the new model is so bad, CR can’t even fake it now.

“The Accord and Camry have high resales values.” To whom?

RicardoHead:
“If track record were any true indication, 1115 would be taking it deep up his äss by different guys every night like his mother did for the past 20 years, but 1115 can’t even get laid ….. so their goes his theory right down the toilet along with his dead gerbil.”

That would be funny if it weren’t so true.

lucklaster: OK, now that a magazine with real credibility has awarded the CTS an honor ….
Well, I already liked it.

lamboz get a life: The fluffer got its ass kicked the last time it was shadowboxing

jjt-
I don’t care that it came from a stupid ass, no
credimundo, inkorama, ragamuffin-
they said it, I stand by it.

I do, too. Motor Trend’s now-meaningless COTY doesn’t make me like it any more. That was my point.

Exactly. If only the apologists would have such a lucid view.

Yes the 92 Accord and the 2007 Accord can be used to prove the reliability of the new Accord because the Accord has a great track record and is proven reliable in previous models. The Malibu or Malibu classic (disgusting) is not proven and neither is the Error. They are not equal in any way shape or form. The Accord and Camry are way superior. The Accord has won numerous awards over the years for reliability and was the best selling car in America at one point then the Camry stepped in and took over. GM’s track record always comes into play and so does Toyotas. One bad model year of Toyota is not equivalent to GM s track record of poor quality cars that have more name changes than lifecycles. A car must prove the test of time and the test of time is more than 1 model year for a new car. The Camry has a track record similar to the Accord and if it has problems now it is still more reliable than an unproven car with a poor past from a company like GM
If the Malibu is classic, I guess the Teraza Ranier and Rendezvous are classic also? Gm putting classic on anything is a disgrace to the very word Classic itself
I never used CR and you never have proven me wrong. Saying it wont make it a reality You seem to do that a lot . The Malibu is classic and the new Malibu is reliebale and so is the Aura ? Keep dreaming they are crap until the stand 10 solid years of no problems and a high resale like the 92 Accord or the 87 Camry yet again.

1115: On the contrary, Toyota has just shown with the Camry V-6 that it only takes one altered powertrain to change reliability.

Yes but 1115, just because you stem from a family of sluts doesn’t mean you are ever going to get laid, despite your delusionary tendencies.

Unless you fück your 1995 CrapCord up its rusty tailpipe.

“Yes (sic) the 92 (sic) Accord and the 2007 Accord can be used to prove the reliability of the new Accord (sic) because the Accord has a great track record and is proven reliable in previous models.”

No. The ‘92 and ‘07 accords can be used to CONVINCE people of something or other about the ‘08 model, but they don’t PROVE anything!

“The Accord and Camry are way superior ….” to the corolla and civic.

“The Accord has won numerous awards over the years (so has Milli Vanilli) and was the best selling car in America at one point then the Camry stepped in and took over.”

Taurus was the best seller forabout four years in between. So What, N’Sync amnd Britney have sold millions of albums, but is that enough to convince people who know music that they’re any good.

“GM’s track record always comes into play and so does Toyotas (sic).” tRUE, THAT’S WHY i’M BUYING MY THIRD gm CAR and every former toyota owner in my family now drives something else.

“If the Malibu is classic …”
There’s such a thing as a classic Malibu, but the Malibu Classic ain’t it!

If you can find an ‘87 camry that’s still running.

R-head: does cheap aluminum rust?

But 1115, they are COMPLETELY different cars. There is NOTHING that is the same from the 92 or 95 or 99 or even 2005 Accord that is similar with the new one except that it has an “H” badge on it. I am sure that the badge works great, but the car just came out. It is NOT proven, just like the new Malibu is not yet proven. You can’t say whether or not brand new cars will be reliable or not. You can predict it, but you could be wrong. I mean, the older Camry’s were good but look what happened with this latest one! The old ones were good, the new one is horrible

Commodore: good post.

It’s hard not to argue with a fool… ;^)

Sometimes, I log onto LLN and think to myself, “what a stupid guy this 1115 is… geesh!” and roll my eyes, but occasionally and recently, I log onto LLN and think to myself, “what a stupid guy this 1115 is…” and laugh my ass off.

Seriously 1115, do what I just did a few posts back. Find something major about the Camry or Accord, and post it on here, with evidence. Post all the reviews you can find, post all the reliability issues you can claim, post all the evidence.

But really in the end I could care less.

Knowing that they’ve made technological achievements in the past will enforce my belief that it’s an innovative car, but it doesn’t create the belief. What advancements has the Honda Accord or Toyota Camry made? The Toyota Camry has tarnished it’s reliability, the Australian version of the same engine has been discontinued due to reliability issues, Toyota admits that they “knew that it was flawed” (why would they do that?), and there’s been a mountain of recalls on them. The last generation Honda Accord wasn’t all that great or reliable either, not a bad car, but nothing really good.

I reinstate what Commodore recently said, about them not being the same car.

The Honda Accord was the best selling car in America for two years. The Ford Taurus was the best selling car for about seven, and it only got better until the quirky design, which wasn’t particularly bad, just bad looking.

Show me proof, you’ve disproved or proved NOTHING.

And yet, you talk about awards, and the Chevrolet Malibu has already won numerous awards, before it’s release.

1115-
Just because you went down on your cousin Bill the first time in one of the asian cars you are always touting doesn’t mean a lot of the rest of us have such romantic notions about those cars. I’ve gottin all my vehicular puss in American cars and trucks.

For a while I was puzzled as to why there is such a discrepancy between the Saturn / Buick sales # . Then it hit me Saturn forces folks to just pay their price , while the Buick dealers are free to bargain. I bet if you let people bargain in a Saturn dealership the #’s would align.

Lack luster they say that jokes are taken from a persons real life Think about it Valiant effort but no pay off
What awards for best imitation of a Diamante? Who the hell are you to instate or reinstate anything? The number one selling car in America is the Camry the runner up is the Accord. The proof is obvious. You have to prove fact to ME!

Under Commodores logic two candidates can go in for a job interview at a major company
The first candidate lets call him Harry Anderson (Honda Accord) and the second candidate Chris Murphy (Chevy Malibu)

Harry finished high school went to an Ivy League school and interned in the field that he is interviewing for. On top of that he has never done drugs and has been an upstanding citizen.

Chris was a high school drop out and didn’t go to college and has no experience in the field that he is interviewing for. He is also a liar a cheat and a thief but he’s “born again” so he wants a fresh start.

The first candidate has a proven track record and is reliable and has a past to prove it. The second candidate has a shaky past and no track record. Let say he’s a born again Christian and wants a fresh start. There is a lot of money to gain or lose with this decision. With Commodores logic Chris would be the better candidate

Under Commodores logic the Chinese car companies come in say that they have a competitor for the Honda Accord that should be considered even though the Chinese competitor is unproven or has a ****ty track record.

What makes the Sebring a POS and not the new Malibu? If anything the Sebring is on the same boat as the Malibu. They are both slackers and both look better than the previous model did but that’s what should happen. The Sebring is just there to get the people who can’t afford a superior Japanese car or stubborn idiots like JJT and Commo. JJ. who really believe and hope that the American car companies can do it. Its hype

The Camry has been and is a reliable car and the best selling in America and one year of inflated problems doesn’t tarnish that. The Malibu was a rental car in its last two models and I don’t see this being any different. It takes more than one model cycle to make or break a car.

The Honda has a proven engine under the hood and I never have read any bad reviews regarding the last models reliability or quality so stop talking out of your ass. If this thing can knock the Camry and Accord out of the top spots then I may stop posting. Until then it sucks and is just a GM.com

BTW Today I saw a brand new 08 Accord coupe in white! JESUS CHRIST that thing is sweet!

And did ya fück it up it’s rusty tailpipe, 1115? Or maybe just think about it.

By the way, no one is joking in their derogatory comments about you.

What “they” say is “the truth is stranger than fiction” which is particularly true in your psychotic case, and all these other “they say” things you pull out your butt are pure fantasy, alongside your fantasy about Japanese superiority.

1115, only you could applaud Honda for taking the Accord coupe’s styling back 5 years to the awful Acura CL.

LOL the awful CL ? What coupe has america made that was nice The Monte Carlon lol
Alejandro- Keep trying You have that same logic that why you have nothing to say

I love 1115’s logic. He ‘conveniently’ leaves out Harry’s recent drinking induced sexual harrasment suit that has cost his company millions. And while Chris isn’t fresh out of rehab, he’s shown a better track record recently.

Who would you hire?

1115 says…
………………… “Polly want a cracker! Polly want a cracker”

.. day after day after day.

And you respond to my comments everyday. At what point was the Accord flawed. Chris is your choice too I see
Hes a loser just like the Malibu. He also has a loser cousin Sam Alton (Saturn Aura)

Honda Accord Known Service Issues:

Airbags: The airbag warning light may come on if a cell phone or laptop computer is plugged into the accessory power socket. (2002)

Automatic transmission: On V6 models, transmissions may fail due to lack of thread-locking compound on nut for low clutch. Honda/Acura has extended warranty on affected vehicles to 7 years or 100,000 miles. (1999-2002)

Brakes: The brake light may not go off. The cause is a saturated float in the master cylinder that should be replaced under warranty or beyond. (1998)

Check-engine light: “Check EngineÓ light may glow on vehicles used where salt is used on the roads because the EVAP solenoid fails. (1998-02)

Oil leak: Oil leaks from multiple locations including bolt holes on V6 engines. (1998-2001)

Paint/body: If the car is driven on rough roads, the spoiler on the trunk can rub through the paint unless spacer pads are installed between the spoiler and trunklid. (1998)

Suspension noise: Loose nuts on the rear stabilizer bar cause it to rattle. (1998)

Transmission problems: Automatic transmission problems prompted to company to extend warranty coverage to 7 years/100,000 miles. (2000-02)

Vehicle noise: Noises come from the top of the windshield and rear window because the teeth for the glass fasteners aren’t engaged. The teeth must be trimmed and a wool felt installed. (1998)

Wheels: Clicking noises from the wheels can be remedied by applying special grease between the wheels and hubs. (1999-2000)

Oh, yeah. PWNED!

lucklaster :1115-
Just because you went down on your cousin Bill the first time in one of the asian cars you are always touting doesn’t mean a lot of the rest of us have such romantic notions about those cars.”

But does that mean it’s not a virgin?

tripe-fluffer: “Under Commodores logic the Chinese car companies come in say that they have a competitor for the Honda Accord that should be considered even though the Chinese competitor is unproven or has a ****ty track record.”

No, the Chinese car should be considered a competitor for the Honda Accord BECAUSE it is ****ty!

A Sebring is ideed a POS, but at least it’s not a accord. Although I’ll soon be driving the new model.
“If anything the Sebring is on the same boat as the Malibu.”
Would that be the boat to japan to show them what a REAL midsizer is?

“The Sebring is just there to get the people who can’t afford a superior Japanese car.”
Let’s check KBB

Back from KBB, and this is what I’ve found

Sebring Limited (3.5, AWD): $25,984 235 bhp
Mazda6 SVE (3.0, FWD): $22,941 212 bhp
Altima SE: (3.5, FWD): $23,407 270 bhp
Legacy R (3.0, AWD) $29,812 245 bhp

While all of these Japanese cars are superior to the Sebring, only the legacy has a higher invoice price. Equipment is largely the same, but the legacy has standard navigation system and moonroof. The Sebring is SOHC. The other Japanese mid-sizer that’s superior to a Sebring is the prius. I didn’t think it would be fair to include that in the comparison

Commuter coffin rankings: Sebring will be 100, since that’s what the fluffer mention. Other numbers are how much sense it makes to buy that car relative to a sebring

1 GM Epsilon 145
2 Mazda6
Ford Fusion 140
4 GM W Body 135
5 Hyundai Sonata 133
Volkswagen Passat 131
Subaru Legacy/Liberty 128
Toyota Prius 117
Altima 116
Galant 105
10 Sebring 100
Kia Optima 99
13 Accord/tl 60
Camry/es350 37

“The Camry has been and is a reliable car.” yeah, you can rely on it to suck!

“If this thing can knock the Camry and Accord out of the top spots then I may stop posting. Until then it sucks.”

Do I have to explain how retarded that sentence is?
By that logic, Jimi Hendrix, velvet Underground and Ike turner all Suck. So does pavement.

CA36GTP: “awful CL?” what a redundancy!

tripleonefluffer: That FWD thing called Monte Carlo was a good car, but looked too garish.

At what point was the Accord flawed. (sic) When they put an “A” on the front.

Airbags: The airbag warning light may come on if a cell phone or laptop computer is plugged into the accessory power socket. (2002)

Automatic transmission: On V6 models, transmissions may fail due to lack of thread-locking compound on nut for low clutch. Honda/Acura has extended warranty on affected vehicles to 7 years or 100,000 miles. (1999-2002)

Brakes: The brake light may not go off. The cause is a saturated float in the master cylinder that should be replaced under warranty or beyond. (1998)

Check-engine light: “Check Engine” light may glow on vehicles used where salt is used on the roads because the EVAP solenoid fails. (1998-02)

Oil leak: Oil leaks from multiple locations including bolt holes on V6 engines. (1998-2001)

Paint/body: If the car is driven on rough roads, the spoiler on the trunk can rub through the paint unless spacer pads are installed between the spoiler and trunklid. (1998)

Suspension noise: Loose nuts on the rear stabilizer bar cause it to rattle. (1998)

Transmission problems: Automatic transmission problems prompted to company to extend warranty coverage to 7 years/100,000 miles. (2000-02)

Vehicle noise: Noises come from the top of the windshield and rear window because the teeth for the glass fasteners aren’t engaged. The teeth must be trimmed and a wool felt installed. (1998)

Wheels: Clicking noises from the wheels can be remedied by applying special grease between the wheels and hubs. (1999-2000)

raiv: You’re right, the accord is a flawless vehicle. Liar!

tripleonefive- Once again, you avoid an argument, mine specifically. I guess you can’t post any evidence, aside from a few biased reviews. I’ve asked you to post evidence numerous times, and yet you can’t find anything.

So, what’s so innovative, special, unique or amazing about the Camry or Accord, that should make me want to buy one?

And what a poor comparison, Chris and

Maybe the reason why we reply to you every day is because your ridiculous! There might be a FEW comments, that have agreed with you, on LLN and other forums. Tell me, why do you think that?

And actually, I drive a 91′ Ford Taurus wagon, V-6. Like I’ve mentioned before, no problems, 150,000 miles and counting. Wonderful vehicle, tons of room, seating for seven and around 25 miles to the gallon. It’s the ton of room that it has that’s prevented me from buying a truck, until now. You know what complaints I have about it?

1-Rat fur carpeting
2-The rear gas cylinders for opening the tailgate wore out about 6 months ago. I bought new ones for 80 bucks, at the local car parts place.

And that’s it. No defects, no problems, very smooth and nicely build, no “body panel gaps” or anything like that. I know I made a smart choice, it isn’t the price or the choice of the vehicle that makes me happy, it’s the service that I get from it.

jjay: You’re a liar!
no ford lasts past 26.2 miles.
I know that because I owned one …
never mind

I don’t think the wife and kids would go for a taurus wago.

I think we’re all wasting our time. 1115 doesn’t know how to get past page 1…

btw, whatever happened to GM_SALES?

Wow, its funny how eager you guys are to jump on me lol. Unfortunately you wasted your time by looking up all that info bc the question posed to juju was what was flawed about the last model Accord (03-07). Some joker (Jjcay 08 I think?) said that the Accord wasn’t that great and I asked why lol. Of course no vehicle is flawless but we all know the Accord is better than any comparable American crap. Also the Accord is a top selling car and will have minor problems here and there but nothing major like the American cars. The other guy got so excited he couldn’t even spell “OWNED” correctly HILARIOUS.

Now if the Malibu actually outsold the Accord and if I gave a **** I would go and find all the date on the Corsica Lumina and first Malibu’s bc they were the direct competitors to the Accord. Also I don’t give a **** about the Sebring its American crap just like the Malibu What I said is that its equally as ****ty as the Malibu. You wasted your time again

I love that JJT did some bs copy and paste and posted it on here. Being that you said you had a Civic that went to 91k but had a Tempo that went to 500k and a truck that went to 800 k with no problems I think its safe to say you are not believable. Anything you post unless I see the article myself is false. You don’t have evidence until I have seen that. My evidence is from resale values and reviews on KBB. I think you don’t know that Shady Powers which I already proved is a pay for play site (ask limbos mother about pay for play) and is trash.

Cite the best selling most reliable car and I guarantee that Accord or Camry will pop up not anything from GM Ford or Chrysler
Also everytime some new slickster comes on this site and wants to jump on the bandwagon doesn’t mean that I have or will pull evidence every single time. Unlike you jack offs I have things to do. Ask Commo and others where I have posted in the past and you will see the evidence I presented new jacks!
Keep the corny jokes coming too. I own your thoughts and actions on this board.

JJ what argument? They are all baseless What awards has the Malibu won? A Taurus with ratty carpeting lol
The Taurus was a mistake by ford and they got rid of it only to put the name on a ****tier car lol
I know it’s hard to admit that the Japanese are building superior better looking more fuel efficient more reliable vehicles but you have to give it up and accept it
I think you were the one who tried to test my 3 Series TL argument and didn’t use similarly equipped vehicles and tried to fudge the numbers in your favor only to be show up .

1115 that was a REALLY bad example that actually helped prove my point. First of all, I am not going to use the stupid names you made up, but the point is that those two people are just that – people. They is not a new edition of them that comes out every 4 years or so, they are essentially the same person they always were. So if Harry or whatever is the 92 Accord, he will ALWAYS be the 92 Accord. He is not ever going to release a new edition of himself and suddenly become the 2008 Accord. Same with the Malibu guy. If he is…say..the 2005 Malibu, he will always be the 2005 ‘Bu – he will never redesign himself completely and become the 2008 Malibu. So yes, the 92 Accord had and still has a good track record so the 1992 Accord can be trusted. The 1992 Accord has proven itself. The 2008 Accord is a BRAND NEW vehicle and has no history. It’s like a baby that was just born a few months ago. It has not gotten older. It has not gone to high school – none of that. We don’t know anything about how it will turn out. Your guess is as good as mine. That is why I gave you the Camry example which you failed to address. The old Camries are mostly good – THEY proved themselves. However, the new one is just growing up and is proving itself to be VERY unreliable and of bad quality with all the problems it has had. Do you understand why you are wrong now?

And no, if a Chinese car comes here it will not automatically be given “a chance” because there are other things we must look at. First of all, it has to be priced right, look good, and be designed well. Since most Chinese cars either look like the scribbles I drew on my notebook in college OR are plagerized designs from Toyoda or GM, most Chinese cars will be eliminating from my shopping list right then and there. That is why the Sebring is not worth being considered – because it looks horrible (especially from the back) and has an all-plastic interior.

“Wow, its funny how eager you guys are to jump on me,”
That what you said at the frathouse? Or was it the outhouse?

“We all know the Accord is better than any comparable American crap.”
1115: the word “crap” is superfluous. If you’re saying “Accord,” and “comparable,” “crap” is implied.

Like the “I” in the sentence “thank you.”

is a top selling car and will have minor problems here and there but nothing major like the American cars. The other guy got so excited he couldn’t even spell “OWNED” correctly HILARIOUS.

“I don’t give a **** about the Sebring.”
I don’t think any of us does, but you bought something even crappier.

I had a Tempo that went to 120k, not 500k, and I’ve never owned a truck. Get your misquotes straight.

“Anything you post unless I see the article myself is false.”
Some one suggested earlier that the Fluffer might be George W. I see that now.

JD power is BS, Fluffer, we all know that. But how did you “prove” it’s a pay-for-play (compound modifier requiring hyphens) site? If you had, wouldn’t John David Power’s racist ass be in jail?

“Cite the best selling most reliable car (sic).
Not one and the same.

“I have things to do.”
Is that what they call ‘em in North Hollywood now?

“The Taurus was a mistake by ford.”
More retardation. You think the company should’ve kept the Granada/

“I know it’s hard to admit that the Japanese are building superior better looking (sic) more fuel efficient (sic) more reliable vehicles (sic) but you have to give it up and accept it.”

No, in some cases Japanese vehicles are all of the above. Not hard to admit that.

“I think you were the one who tried to test my 3 Series TL argument …”

I didn’t test your argument, I supported an earlier claim I made.

http://www.leftlanenews.com/hyundai-genesis.html

Commodore: some people will, under the right circumstances, try a Chinese car.

The only circumstances under which someone would even consider to buy a Chinese car would be because of the fact that most Chinese cars are often half the price of the car they copied (because the Chinese car company that made the car didn’t have to spend much money on developing the car since they just copied it, it was built for under $2 an hour, and they depress their currencies so they can cheaply export them). Even 1115 can afford the BYD city car that was a Toyoda copy – it only cost $3200 when converted into dollars. Anyway, don’t let this post distract you 1115. I’d rather that you respond to my last post (about JJT’s). Besides, this isn’t directed at you anyway

I understand that you would trust a drop out before you would trust a proven winner!
You would take the chance on the loser and overlook the proven winner is what I understand you can twist it around any way you want but no one would take the chance on the Malibu
You are truly a fool. I know you are an idiot but I didn’t know you were a complete idiot. The real world doesn’t work that way and for you to say that you would hire CM just to prove a point is ridiculous. You will never be in a position of power with that sort of thinking. Its people like you that have kept GM down all these years. Stubborn ignorant American pride
The Accord -all of them have great track records or better than their American comp so you acting as if 92 was the only good one is silly.

In addition you have bad concepts of time bc you don’t even know that Buicks 2007 models are current models and that was a loooong time ago in your opinion but 1914 was just around the corner lol . Also it only takes one year to prove oneself even if someone has a longer track record
The Malibu is just as ****ty Sebring Its no real comp to the Camry and the Accord or even the 09 Sonata when it comes to the US
It’s not going to happen and you hoping and praying won’t make it happen either
Hey you are the guys who want me lol JJT whatever fantasies you have take them out on Impulsive or Limbos. You are a janitor so mop this **** up I don’t expect you to understand this conversation

JJT posts are garbage just like the garbage he takes out at his job
Concentrate Commo

You seem to have missed my point 1115 that the 92 Accord or 97 Accord or whatever other older generation Accord there is, is completely different than the newest one. Same with the Malibu, same with every other car. Of course I would NOT pick the high school drop out, but in the case of the brand new Malibu vs the brand new Accord, like I said, both of them are babies. They have not even gotten to high school. They have no “track record” because they have yet to build one. It is just like with the Aura – so far, the car has been perfect (as you can see from that site you kindly provided me with which lists ZERO recalls for the Aura). The Aura has been consistently reliable for a year, hopefully that will never change.

The point with the Malibu and Accord is that they are both new cars. I am not biased, and I can honestly say that both the Malibu and Accord are great cars, amongst the leaders in their segments. Both have great interiors. Both have things I don’t like about them (the Accord is too pudgy while the Malibu needs a new butt). As of right now, both cars are fair game, both are equal (even though Motor Trend put the ‘Bu ahead of Accord). It is your choice, the point is that the Malibu is certainly not trash and deserves to be tried out. That is what a smart shopper would do – even if he ends up buying the Accord. An import humper will overlook the Malibu because he is in the mentality that American cars are demons or something and that they can’t be trusted. Personally, I don’t trust Japanese companies much anymore because (1) they are all obsessed with making tons of money and becoming #1 in sales and that sort of thing which makes them overlook quality and (2) just look at what is happening with Toyoda.

“You will never be in a position of power with that sort of thinking. Its people like you that have kept GM down all these years. Stubborn ignorant American pride” – who? me in a position of power? cool!

But c’mon – I think it is time to stop with the “you like America therefore I win the argument”. Guess what? You don’t. Oh, and cool fact about me….I wasn’t born in the United States.

No you missed my point the Malibu represents the unproven loser and the Harvard grad represents the proven winner
Which one do you choose? Stop bull****ting
Im not biased but I can say that the Malibu has proven to be a rental car POS and the Accord was the best selling car at one point and has always been a top seller with a high resale and a solid performer that earned rep for reliability.
I said You will never be in a position of power I think you have a mental block in your head or something
(1) they are all obsessed with making tons of money and becoming #1 in sales and that sort of thing which makes them overlook quality-WHAT HAS GM BEEN DOING FOR THE LAST 20 YEARS AND COUNTING ?
I think its time you realized that GM has not proven their cars reliable The Saturn Aura has been out for a year and this Malibu just dropped In 10 years with a solid track record good sales it may be worth considering but as of this moment its just another POS from GM and the smart consumer would and should buy the car that is proven just like the company would hire the Harvard grad

1115:”At what point was the Accord flawed”

Me: Citing many examples of known service issues to show that the Accord has flaws

1115: “Of course no vehicle is flawless but we all know the Accord is better than any comparable American crap”

So here we have the heart of the argument. You make disingenious arguments with cherry picked data (for instance you seem to always cite resale values. But do you know where these values come from? Do you know what goes into them? I doubt it.) and when you are called on it you change the subject or try to reframe the statement.

Face it, you’ve become drunk on the corporate Kool Aid, and you make no sense.

And BTW, I didn’t misspell OWNED, I typed, and meant, PWNED. Don’t know what that means? Look it up.

Now, I said I would not argue with a fool and I broke my own rule. I am not planning on replying to you any further, so don’t take my silence as a victory. I will be watching the Toyota recall threads and giggling my ass off at fools like you.

You are blabbering away as nobody said anything again. Go back and re read my post. It says everything in there that I need to say. I have already said that the 08 Malibu and Accord are both completely new cars. They have a clean slate and are just starting to build a track record. If you choose to ignore the Malibu because the 2002 Malibu was recalled or whatever consider that the 2006 Accord was recalled as well. Any kind of track record that past generations of a model have do not provide FACTUAL evidence to say that the model is reliable. You can’t know for sure, as I said, because look at what happened to the Camry (lots of problems) and the Aura (no problems). You didn’t expect those cars to turn out that way did you?

And yes, at one point GM was only concerned with making money. Fortunately, they are not being greedy right now and instead Toyoda is repeating GM’s mistakes.

Fluffer: Back to the “janitor” insults. Not working.

The Aura has been consistently reliable for a year, hopefully that will never change.

“Im (sic) not biased but I can say that the Malibu has proven to be a rental car POS.” How so?

Fluffer: depends on what he did at harvard Vs. what the other guy did and Public State Land-Grant University, doesn’t it?

Commodore: “look at what happened to the Camry (lots of problems) and the Aura (no problems). You didn’t expect those cars to turn out that way did you?”
Yeah, I did. Track records, ya know?

Gads, my opinion for what it is worth. A nameplate isn’t a certainty for quality. I worked at a Honda dealer for years watching the same bobtailed truck bringing loads of replacement transmissions 3 times a week. It was so bad that they had a battery powered lift just for them. I’ve owned 3 Toyotas and 2 of them were trashed at 65k miles, another lasted 200k. I’m still driving an Accord that hasn’t had a single problem. I drove 3 GM products during the 90’s and gasp, they were flawless in the maitenence area. It looks like Chevy has a hit on its hands and its about time. Regardless of what brand you like this is good for all of us. The Malibu will gain some conquest sales and every interior in the market is going to get upgraded because of it. This isn’t a win/lose guys, we all get to win because GM (previous home of the worlds 2nd worst interiors, now belonging to Chrysler) has woken up. With a new powertrain its going to be awhile before we know but I suspect they will come out just fine, GM knows what it has to lose if it doesn’t.

The Aura just came out give it time and it will fail just like all the other GMs
Still go for the dropout loser huh That sounds right bc you are a janitor and you relate to drop outs