Btw, tripleonehavenofriends, don’t Toyotas have microchips in them? Weren’t those invented in the U.S.? What is wrong with one car company purchasing another car company’s tech and improving upon it? Obviously, for the time being, Ford is the leader in Hybrid efficiency. That does not mean Toyota will not respond and do a darn good job in reply. Quit being such a sycophant.

And I am sorry to other posters for replying to tripleoneracist, but this is not the kindergarten. You cannot allow evil people to spread lies and hate by ignoring them. We all have to confront evil. We will never silence tripleonefive, but at least he will not labor under the assumption that people accept his b.s.

Because his post is about the most rank in terms of racism I have ever read on this forum.

Now, go take the aforementioned firehouse and clean off your keyboard as we all know you’ve been typing b.s. all day.

Where’s triple one flipper, so we can get some sensible 111somethin’ posts?
My lil bitch posts when I tell him to Lionpride you dont even make sense Post something about a car

If both systems are the same, which I’ll repeat again, Ford developed on it’s own and Toyota developed on it’s own, why not share a few parts? You might as well say the Sebring is copying the Fusion because they use the same radiator hose!

And to my further knowledge, I don’t believe Ford’s hybrid system even shares any components from Toyota. They’ve had this liscence open for years now and… they have yet to share anything major.

Give credit where credits due. Both Ford and Toyota developed their own systems. Kudo’s to both.

And here’s a tip; learn to read things in context.

True Innovation is what separates a Great Company from a Wannabe or a Soon to be Has been auto company. You can not truely be a Great company in any field by borrowing licensed patents to use in your products. THe only exception is that. A Company may use it as a stop gap measeure to get the company thru a jam and to into a better period where they can catch up. This Recession would be a good example of a time to use it. And is the only time you use it.

Using a patent on a sparingly basis ok. Consistently doing it makes you look the fool.

I won’t trouble you any further. I can see your side of things.

No one argues that Ford/GM made inferior products for years, but this had NOTHING to do with the productivity of the American workforce. Nothing.

A smart person would say “Why would Toyota allow Ford to use Toyota tech to compete against a Toyota product?” Very simple

Toyota is looking to breed acceptance of Hybrids as the THE powertrain of the future. And they know, when it comes down to it, the can outproduce and outperform any hybrid from any other maker. Competition will breed inteerst in the genre, and sales long-term, of which Toyota’s leadership will earn it the Lion’s share, like Ford with the F-series pick-up 50+ years ago.

It is in Toyota’s best interest to get Hybrids over, no matter who makes them

BTW, licensing agreements aren’t free. Toyota gets paid for the patent infringement

The Fusion has a newer, smaller, more advanced battery. It’s been more than 2 years since Toyota invented the Camry Hybrid. All Ford had to do was knock-off the hard parts, and find a supplier to make a smaller, more powerful battery.

Give Ford credit.
Just not Too much credit.
DrFill

I really do not mean to pick a fight, but U.S. workers are routinely the most productive in the world. I do not know what sources you prefer to believe, but hopefully CBS’ format will be acceptable:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/09/03/business/main3228735.shtml

And to address why Americans are so fat. Much of the weight is due to our sedentary lifestyle and one of the largest contributors to that is long hours spent working (only Japanese workers spend more average hours working/day than Americans). You can’t exercise (or see your children), walk to lunch or take the time to cook healthy meals when you are constantly working to be the most productive workers. Again, I do not mean to pick a fight. However, having seen my father toil for 16 hours a day and 6 days a week in his pharmacy (I pretty much grew up without a dad as a result), I can confirm that at least one American is anything but lazy.

http://pressroom.toyota.com/Releases/View?id=TYT2004062345528

“Is Ford using the Toyota hybrid system?

Although the Ford hybrid system is very similar to Toyota’s, Toyota is not directly supplying any components to Ford. Toyota and Ford have entered into a licensing agreement allowing Ford to use technology that had been patented by Toyota. Toyota welcomes the introduction of the Escape hybrid and Ford’s effort to demonstrate and gain acceptance of this important environmental technology.”

Any more questions about Ford using Toyota’s hybrid system?

But that ignores the fact that the Japanese and South Koreans have to use Americans workers to be competitive in the US. They made themselves at our expense. But we may start getting some of our money back if HONDA HQ relocates to the USA.

Truthfully, The American Worker is the best in the world but the proverbial country mile. The issue is what they are working on. It would seem FORD has been asking the hard questions on that but is still getting some soft answers in return (Edge – could be much better as a true Performance Utility Vehicle, Flex – Wanted: The Explorer America, the Euro Focus – Wanted: Every version in the US, Fiesta – it’s been in Mexico for a while, and the Falcon – Wanted: A date certain for the US). But even those answers are yielding dividends.

Again, the American worker is the best and they were paid like it. But to every day comes a night. No, the line workers are not being paid $75/hour- that just the tabulated cost for health and benefits for all the workers including those who retired 40+ years ago. In truth, they get paid less than those working for TOYOTA and HONDA. But taken at $75/hour it does show an enormous need to get those retired workers off the books and health costs under control.

You can blame the Union Leadership and the Company Execs for that mess. As with a Movie, I never blame the actors, I blame the Director and the Writer.

Now, go take the aforementioned firehouse and clean off your keyboard as we all know you’ve been typing b.s. all day.

Where’s tripleoneflipper, so we can get some sensible 111somethin’ posts?

So if it is a consumer mindset which way as a provider of goods is the proper path.

I think we are saying the same things

The biggest facing new drive train technologies, is so much your attitude but really consumer mindset. When gas was cheap people bought SUVs and trucks like there was no tomorrow. When gas threatened $6.00 a gallon the cry for more fuel efficient cars, hybrids and diesels, went out.

The companies responded. The arguments still remain that they are more fuel efficient and are future. Whether it is 2010 or 2020 or 2030 is yet to be said. But that day is coming.

Cost is not an issue if, and this is what gets diesel in trouble when you do not, you tabulate the costs over time. A Parallel hybrid like a Toyota and Lexus hybrid, costs more up front. But over time, repays that in fuel savings. The problem is that Diesel is actually a better alternative to Parallel hybrids because of the marginal improvements in f/econ. On this I agree with you. Parallel hybrids have complex transmissions because it is really two power plants attached to the same transmission. As a Mercedes-Benz engineer deftly remarked “You are paying for two drive trains”. The cost and the marginal improvement is a profound letdown. GM’s weak hybrid basically bolting a motor to the engine is a wiser alternative needing less battery and used really only for parking maneuvers without interfering with normal drain train functions.

However, a Serial Hybrid, like the Chevy Volt and Fisker Karma, poses upwards or two and three times the f/econ of a comparably performing vehicle. You can save money by not requiring the huge battery packs, which make up easily 30-40% of the cost to manufacture the car. But drop the battery and using a smaller much more fuel efficient engine to spin a generator to power the motor that is itself 3-4 times more efficient than the engine running the generator (the Fisker uses a 300Kw motor = 375hp) and you get all the f/econ for roughly the same cost, with the instant torque. Problem is building a transmission that can take the beating E-motors dish out on gears. Direct drive in the wheels is that solution. Also spares the need and costs of a transmission plus fixes that vexing performance issue.

Maintenance? AC-induction, Brushless or Multiphase, motors are utterly fault free. They work or they don’t. The engines are no more or less vulnerable to failure than a conventional car. Serial Hybrids have the same advantages plus the engine is never really working very hard so it will last much longer.

The problem is that the cars are being made to do too much up front. With the Volt you could have had a 50+mpg family car for maybe a couple grand more. There was no need for the batteries upfront. Maybe GM will see that and make the batteries optional later. Parallel hybrids are not even a stop gap. Intelligently boosted engines would do better.

But to achieve the total goal of ending oil dependency, ultimately the ICE is going to have to be reduced and eventually eliminated. It won’t happen overnight, but it will happen.

How can it exceed Toyota when its using its old tech or sorry paid “royalties” to Toyota and its not proven on the road its estimates ? MORON!

But realistically? Same thing happened with many Toyota hybrids. (and any hybrid for that matter)
It probably will be about 38. Still not bad.

But as hell Ford, ADVERTISE THIS. Milk this dry.
You certainly need this.
Maybe fear sell, warning buyers gas’ll skyrocket again to $4 gas, according to a “study”.
Anything.

Get those numbers UP (sales, I mean).

-eat your cereal

Your a funny guy triple, Toyogasm….oooohhhh what a feeling