Comments on: Ford shareholder critical of reality TV show plan, Bill Ford

By: digitalzombie

digitalzombie — Sat, 13 May 2006 07:51:49 +0000

He got the I hate jewish people just like my great granddaddy Henry Ford look.
JK. Ford is alright I guess. They do have some memorable cars. Got burn with the Failure remark funny lol.

By: tommy boy

tommy boy — Fri, 12 May 2006 16:12:22 +0000

Just to beat a dead horse I would like to mention that a lot of the details are done without focus groups (surface breaks, tweaks to headlights etc.) and this is where a decent design can become a great design – my point is that Ford probably has some pretty good designers but on a whole they are not that impressive – and I don’t think it’s fair to blame focus groups or bean counters etc. – good designers find a way to solve problems, whether its coming up with design solutions or pushing back against the bean counters or marketing.

By: junkie

junkie — Thu, 11 May 2006 22:53:20 +0000

Pete you are quite right about the beancounters. I meant the marketers, who often don’t want to alienate some groups so things get watered down.

tommy boy different companies use different research methods for their groups, as you mention. Perhaps the General should hire the folks who attended the recent Chrysler groups!

By: Pete

Pete — Thu, 11 May 2006 22:08:10 +0000

“Beancounters change designs so as to not offend, taking a low-risk approach.” Actually, the reason for the “bean counters” (accountants) has really nothing to do with design – it’s all about cost efficiency and profitability.

If it were cheaper to produce handsome/innovative cars vs. boring/mundane cars, you would see a lot more handsome/innovative cars on the road.

All the complaints about cheap plastics, cheap (OEM) tires, and fake this and that (wood, aluminum trim, etc.) are due to the “bean counters” trying to minimize costs and maximize profits.

Often times design suffers as a result of cost-savings measures taken to bring a product in at a certain price-point, and thereby earn a certain profit per vehicle. Can’t fault the automakers (and their shareholders) for wanting to make a profit. Can’t fault the consumers for complaining about cheap materials and poor quality.

By: tommy boy

tommy boy — Thu, 11 May 2006 22:02:17 +0000

Chrysler breaks up the focus groups by placing the participants in different categories and giving some more weight than teh others (forward thinking, conservative, etc.). I work in the design industry and the clients I serve are the closest thing to a focus group I work with, but the great ideas I’ve turned out have always been the ones picked by the client, (usually a marketing group). My experience is that if you show them crap they will have to pick it, if you show them good ideas most people will pick the good ideas (I’ll grant that focus groups have many weirdo social things going on but I still believe that great ideas will more often then not get picked.)

By: tommy boy

tommy boy — Thu, 11 May 2006 21:13:41 +0000

I’d also add it doesn’t matter what school you come from, great designers are hard to find just like great artists, your run of the mill car designer is not great, ford probably has lots of them, the guy who did the new challenger would qualify as a great designer to me, also the guy who did the boxster.

By: tommy boy

tommy boy — Thu, 11 May 2006 21:09:51 +0000

the escape, and maybe the mustang are Ford’s nicest looking cars (aside from the GT). The 500 is decent overall except for the grill and headlights, same with the fusion and the milan – they can’t seem to get the headlights right, and you think they don’t deserve to be slapped around? I’ll give the ford designers an “average”, they don’t compare to audi and Chrysler designers – if ford designers really had great stuff the beancounters and focus groups would embrace the ideas – Chrysler gets awesome designs to go forward all the time.

By: 6ix

6ix — Thu, 11 May 2006 21:05:31 +0000

Industrial/transportation designers come from the same schools. It just depends on which company recruits them. they’ll stay with one company for a couple of years and then move on. It’s a rotating door from studio to studio.
My point is to not bash on any of the design teams. It’s not their fault. They all have the same talent at their disposal. It’s how the beancounters water it down. It’s companies like GM and Ford, that are directed by a bunch of old folks, that show great concepts, but never deliver the goods to the public.

By: junkie

junkie — Thu, 11 May 2006 20:12:24 +0000

Ford has plenty of good designers. The reality show is a slap in the face to them.

The beancounters and marketers just water-down the good stuff, and we (in the U.S.) end up with the results.

By: tommy boy

tommy boy — Thu, 11 May 2006 18:35:23 +0000

He has this blank look in his eyes like the lights are on but nobody’s home,

I do think the concept reality show would be cool and could create buzz if they had some decent car designers out of school or in between jobs to battle it out.