Kudos to GM then. Toyota has something of a monopoly on this hybrid technology deal, but at least they had the balls to come out and admit their batteries had problems and are taking careful measures to fix them. Either way it’ll be good to have this competition.

I’m waiting for the GM fanboys to chime in singing Volt’s praises, even while they feel free to bash hybrid technology from other manufacturers, though. ::Waits::

This is exactly the kind of news we need to be hearing from GM to help turn things around. Beating Toyota to the next-gen. hybrid punch could work wonders. Although with Toyota’s resources, I wonder if this means Toyota will advance its time-table. Just imagine the strides GM could have made had it not been forced to buy out of its Fiat buy out for a couple of billion or plunked down $900 million to hang a few banners at the Olympics.

Hybrids are not practical in the least. As I’ve explained before, the savings will never outweigh the cost of purchase unless gas skyrockets to $10/gallon or if mileage driven exceeds 50,000 per year. Even then it will still take years to payoff.

If I tried explaining that to a prospective customer, all it would do is lower my CSI and they’d still buy the car. So, hey. I’ll keep my mouth shut and be thankful that I’m getting more product that will sell in droves.

Before I get flamed, I should let it be known that I’m aware that the Volt is not merely another hybrid car.

This will be the biggest GM image-boost in years, maybe even decades. “Hydrogen fuel-cell design” is also music to my years – can’t wait to get away from hybrids and move to something that is alternative fuel, that uses no gasoline. I’ll be disappointed if the Volt ends up as just another regular car with a small electric motor that GM just uses for publicity and crap.

Lastly, I’m glad Toy is stopping and checking the quality, they seem to have been paying attention to it less and less lately as profits pour in with each car they stamp out. Toy better protect that reputation for quality if it want’s to be on top..

Bryce,
When hybrids first hit the scene, I’d agree with you, even considering tax breaks. But now that there are mild hybrids on the market (for example, from U.S. makers like Saturn’s Green Line and the Ford Escape hybrid, etc.) where the premium paid for the technology is lower because the hybrid system is not as sophisticated, and with $3+ per gallon gas prices, and if a buyer hangs on and drives his hybrid into the ground, the math might come out differently.
When plug-in hybrids are introduced, the math will be different, but still have to be done. How much will the electricity cost (to you and to the environment) to plug in a car every night? Will that cost, plus the premium paid for the battery and powertrain technology, justify the purchase?

Let’s just not have this project crushed GM, the American automotive industry desperately needs a eco-friendly halo project.

Hybrids aren’t quite the answer still, but this is great news- make it a plug in while your at it too!

They need to race those things! Racing improves the breed, better batteries, motors, engineering of the vehicles themselves, and so on.

Still This is forward movement. I love it.

iJay – Curious, why do you feel plug-ins will be successful or popular?

Most know I am not a big fanatic of hybrids. The Volt poses the possibility of being less of a joke, but I’ll reserve judgement until mileage specs come out. I simply can’t reconcile the fact that over 1000 pounds of toxic batteries are needed for every single hybrid produced. I’m curious what the battery weight vs steel ratio is. It’s a hypocritical solution for the enviros. And the cost-benefit for the fuel conscious is not enough. If the Volt manages 60-80 EPA rated MPG then it will represent the first cost effective hybrid. Until then Chevy Aveos, Honda Civics, Jetta TDIs, and Minis are the way to go. Don’t get me started on SUV or $100K hybrids.

I don’t feel plug-in hybrids will be any more succsessful than the current hybrids, Piablo.

Simply put, it’s only an improvement over current hybrids. As long as the manufacturer doesn’t plan on increasing it’s range with more batteries to be charged at night, it’s really simple. Most people don’t commute any more than 15 miles in the city, so why not run on electricity until the way back? You’ll be using half the gas you would if it was in hybrid mode. The Europeans get the option of having an “electric only” button, unlike the American ones which have a little blank spot in the dash. I forget the range, but like I mentioned most people don’t commute more than a few miles, it’s beneficiary to the money in your pocket, and the enviroment.

I agree though, current hybrids are more or less a marketing stunt.

When I mentioned the electric only button, I meant on the Prius.

Hybrids are just a transitional technology. They are just a way to say “I care” and to show that you do until actually alternative tech comes out that will move us away from gasoline.

Scarface03 – the Ford Escape Hybrid is fine, but the Saturn Aura hybrids nets you only an increase of TWO extra MPG. That is not worthwhile at all, even if it is the cheapest hybrid out there at the moment.

Scarface03,
Lower cost systems, higher gas prices, and a longer length of ownership do impact savings. Still takes awhile to payoff. Price difference between the Saturn Aura XE and Green Line Hybrid is $1,700. At $3.10/gal. over 15,000 miles, it takes 3.84 years to payoff. Great, so right on the average trade cycle. It’s a wash with 0% or as a cash deal. Traditional financing, however, will cause it to be an expense. Financially speaking, if it is a wash, what’s the benefit?

15,000 miles per year*

iJay – I’m not sure about the living within 15 miles statistic, but let’s say that’s true. Most people who live in populated cities live in apartments. Pretty impossible for apartment dwellers to make use of a plug-in option. For those with a garage, they’ll need a recepticle in the garage first. Not to mention, I don’t believe it will be a standard recepticle. Even a clothes dryer or oven need a higher output recepticle. I think it’s yet another feel-good marketing ploy duping the public.

Bryce – nice breakdown. Not to mention cost of maintenance for the electrical components. Anyone know how much it costs to replace a battery pack? Let’s just say beware of getting into a wreck with a hybrid. On top of damage costs, better hope the HAZMAT team does not have to show up. They aren’t covered by insurance plans.

If GM can just get the cost down into the same ballpark with conventional-fuel vehicles, per Bryce’s math, it’s a winner.

My wife just watched the documentary “Who Killed the Electric Car?” and she now thinks GM is evil. It will take a Volt, and a lithium-ion Vue, and some really tangible progress on the hydrogen front to change her view. If she can’t buy a plug-in Vue in ‘90 or ‘10, I won’t be allowed to buy a Cadillac CTS to put in the same garage. GM has to pursue this stuff not only as a halo-effect project but with a view to long-term returns. If we are all going to be off foreign oil in 25 to 30 years, we have to start somewhere and take intermediate steps.

I like toyota’s hybrid drive system, with the battery charging during braking

Piablo: You’re talking sense again. DShould’t 43 mpg in a Yaris be enough?

Also what will be the coust to haul away the batteries?

GM should never have killed the EV-1.
The Volt can be a winner

Well, I know personally that I drove about 15 miles around Washington D.C. daily. I’d assume though most others don’t drive much more, unless their job location is out of the city or they take the Metro.
It’s the start and stop traffic that really gets to the purpose of an electric motor though, Piablo. I’d have to look into the plug-in requirements, but as far as I know the foreign Prius can run on electric only, and theres currently an American firm that changes Prius’s (or Pri?) to plug in, for a hefty price (mostly because of new batteries).

Prii is the most common usage I’ve seen

Oh, and Piablo – where do you get the 1000+ lb figure for hybrid batteries? The Prius battery weighs about 110 lbs:

http://www.toyota.com/html/hybridsynergyview/2006/fall/battery.html

That would makes you wrong by a factor of about 10. What’s next, your Sudbury rant?

What will be cool is when GM comes out with a well-priced 70mpg zero-emissions Volt and thus force the greenie enviropsychos to suck it up and buy American (from GM, no less!) or be exposed as the hypocritical bastards they are.

Damn I hope GM beats Toyota to this punch.

TomF – that’s the power of one-sided propaganda films. Just don’t let her watch Sicko or else you guys are gonna be moving to Canada. BTW, you’re getting an ‘08 CTS? good choice.

this will be an enourmous victory for GM. Quality is my concern. It must have the reliability of a gasoline engine auto. We cannot have volts dying and causing accidents or lawsuits. GM must really make sure they have everything accounted for prior to launch

“this will be an enourmous victory for GM.”
It’s pretty possible. But for how long? Two years until Toyota or someone else develops their batteries?

RobCali – who cares? Of course other automakers will copy a great idea. Besides, the Volt is way less ugly than the Prius. If Toy comes out with a Prius-lookin thing TWO years after GM I think Toy will be in trouble. Its the Honda FCX I’m really worried about

Why not 100% fully electric vehicles? This hybrid nonsense is just stupid…

So is the hydrogen fuel cell nonsense.

http://teslamotors.com is proof of what a fully electric vehicle can do. And now A123systems has developed a nano-technology batter that has 300 times the number of charge cycles and can charge in as little as 10 minutes.

What is this new LLN verb ….. “co-devlop” ????? Did GM really enter into a Co-Devlopment Contract with someone?
.
Commodore, I think I read that the Honda FCX is like $80k or so. I don’t think I would worry about it competing with the Volt.

I HOPE THEY ARE MAKING A POSITIVE MOVE.

trade her in for a new untainted model tomf.