Too bad that their only true (current) success, the Insight is a low-volume low-margin model. I guess people right now aren’t too excited to plop down $30k for a Pilot or Accord V6.

50% decline in the US and a net profit plunge of 77.2%. The domestics were running lean aready because of legacy costs, but the bad economy has hit everyone, including the infallible Japanese.

Well when I see Honda selling off or killing brands then they are in trouble The Bottom line is they make better cars that GM Chrysler and Ford.
Im tired of seeing that jerkoff Howie Long in those Chevy commercials Wow the Malibu is estimated to get 1more mpg on the highway than an Accord lol. Even if its tru why take a chance on an unreliable car liike the Malibu
The new GM is the old GM

orangecones, I’m not sure what you use to judge success and failure, but you’re not really on point here. The Fit was a massive hit for them in 2008. Massive. They planned to sell about 60k in the US in 2008, and sold nearly 100k after diverting production to build them for the US. But, to your second point, the margin is low. Then you look at the Civic, which became one of the top 3 selling vehicles by the end of the year. The CR-V became the top selling SUV in the country in 2008.

The Insight was barely available in fiscal 2008, so your point is moot. Also, the new Accord has sold pretty well in 2008 considering the economic climate. You see a lot of 4 cylinder versions out there.

They had a really bad Q4, like everyone, but you can’t say they only had 1 success, and it was low volume.

Their failures are bigger issues. The Ridgeline continues to be a disappointment, and the redesign of the Pilot wasn’t very well received, and was easily trounced by the redesigned Highlander (which is an excellent SUV for similar money, but much much nicer inside). The Odyssey remains a solid performer. They keep selling the Element, god knows why, and it keeps not really doing much in the market. They got some lift when they tried to reposition it against the Scion xB, but it just can’t compete, and really isn’t a competitor for the xB. It’s a compromise of an SUV that has no real market.

@1115

Go read the stats. Ford and GM both top Honda in quality, lagging Toyota by a single 1/10 (Ford) of a point.

Honda sold over 1.2 millions Fit worldwide since introduction in 2002. US is not exactly prime market for FIt. In retrospect, Honda did not make same 5 billions it did in March of 2008 for fiscal year but it did make 1.7 billions. For those who don’t have problems understanding numbers and signs, combined Domestic Auto Industry lost well over 20 billions (-20 billion vs +1.7). To emphasize the point, stock owners of GM and Ford lost a lot during last year, much more then Honda’s and taxpayers of US about to loose much more then former stock holders.

Honda should turn the Element into an industrial vehicle instead of a passenger vehicle. It’s ugly as hell, but I like the waterproof interior. My camera crew could definitely use one.

@ borat
Their should be NO market for the fit. The fuel mileage is not impressive and the crash ratings suck, it is a death trap. It is Hondas throw away car, take it for what it is and not for what it is not. Plus, a lot of the domestics problems have to do with the huge money paid out to current and retired employees and has no more to do with quality problems than any other manufacturer out there. Thats why concessions from the UAW and CAW were so important to the viability plans of Chrysler and GM.

Honda and Toyota..extremely well built very boring automobiles. Have had several, probalbly could have driven them forever. The majority of car buyers do not purchase a car because they think they can drive it forever, they purchase them because they want the car more than they want thier hard earned money. They gey excited about it. Can anyone out there tell me they actually get excited about driving a Hybrid small compact car. Honda and Toyota will always be great companys that build great cars. The Companys that build exciting cars and trucks that people reallly enjoy are currently being helped by the US Government. I look foreward to seeing what they come up with.

Payton – yea according to what study or stats ? A Detroit study commisioned by Ford lol There is no crediblle evidence that GM or Ford oare even close to Honda and Toyota

Ford might be close because Mazda helps them, GM could be close because Opel, Holden and others help them, Chrysler on the other hand perhaps is better because they abandoned their “let’s built the cheapest POS Neon we can” attitude.
Just goes to show you that if they WANT to build a good car, they CAN, but most of the time they don’t. And besides, why not? Most car makers make much more money on repairs at their dealerships than on the car sale itself.

But really? So what if Honda posted a loss. The Big 3 here started sh**ing bricks when gas prices went up and everyone stopped buying overpriced SUVs and trucks and have been posting losing quarters for the past few years.

big3, I believe you are (partially) wrong. I will grant you that the younger car buyer (say, sub 30) will spend money on a car he wants (probably something sporty until the family catches up with him), something fun to drive, and even if its not exactly reliable (because he knows its his “i graduated college, this is my gift to myself” car). Also the 55+ market will buy a Buick or Vette (depending on economic conditions). That leaves all the middle agers out there who’s #1 and #2 concerns are: How long can I drive it on 1 tank? and How long can I drive it before it falls apart?. This is why cars like the Camry and Accord are doing so fantastically well. Yes they are boring, but fuel economy is pretty good (for their family friendly size) and they literally run forever.

moparsalesman1, free market is a perfect decision maker what has market value and what doesn’t. There are 300 million people live in US and 5.7 billion elsewhere. Not all 5.7 billions are driving RAM trucks (even fewer are driving five pointed star cars). Fit is a perfect solution for world automotive needs (considering sales figures). Accidentally, did Chrysler sold 1.2 million vehicles altogether in the same period of time?

Ford’s quality may have improved, unfortunately this gain is only temporary. With the buy back of Mazda stock (by Mazda) Ford has lost its access to the new 3 and 6 platforms. The quality ratings of vehicles based on the 3 and 6 platform are directly related to the utilization of the platform from Mazda. With the loss of access, Ford will again return to the utilization of European platforms. The utilization of European platforms sounds like a solid bet, however Fords past experience should sound the alarm for the direction that they are headed. Past vehicles like the Mondeo / Mistique or Fiesta were mediocre at best. Going back to the Merkur (with help from Cosworth) and you will see another failure. Switching to GM you can look at the Opel import (Cadillac Catera) and you will find yet another flop. Don’t expect any quality gains to stick. Pulling away from Mazda will have repercussions once the platforms become unavailable.

nailout- the article was about Honda….this was your second “BASH FORD” comment today…hummm…Article about Honda… I guess I will use this thread to bash Ford….dumbsh#t!!

GM, Ford, Honda, Toyota are all high quality cars.

If you want JUNK look at VW and Audi, and 2.7 liter V6 Chryslers…… and Nissans… junk at 130,000 miles.

Then again, Nissan’s Infiniti arm usually are at the top of the reliability charts, go figure.

I think Ford wanted to sell Mazda since they didn’t want them to go under with them, and they could use the cash. Again, like GM and the Vibe, what prevents them from sharing parts? Ford still needs 4 cyl engines.

Ford may sell most of its share in Mazda, but Ford still has in the place the technology interchange agreement that allows Ford to use Mazda technology. Indeed, the next Ford Focus due summer 2010 will use the same platform as the current Mazda3 and also will continue to use Mazda derived I-4 “Duratec” engines. And the new Focus may get the new direct-injected engines with the Mazda-developed Smart Idle Stop System (SISS), which will definitely improve the EPA city rating because it stops the engine on idle to save on fuel.

Nissan is 2 problems at 3 years (industry average is 1.7) while Infiniti is at 1.4.

Toyota is at 1.3 and Lexus at 1.3.

Honda is at 1.5 and Acura at 1.5

Chevrolet at 1.8 with Buick at 1.2 and Cadillac at 1.5.

Why the differences? At GM it is due to trucks pretty much. Trucks overall have a worse score than cars and since GM is so heavy into truck sales this drags down Chevys numbers. Why does Toyota score so well? Their trucks are at the top of the segments they compete in AND their truck percentage is much lower.

But again the differences in quality is pretty much nil. 1.3 vs. 1.8 is not perceivable to a customer. Most everyone still have one to two problems.

Clearly badge engineering, the half ass SOHC engines and those hideous designs are catching up to their once stellar reputation. They dont have any legacy costs because they treat their retirees like dirt in Japan.
bailout: You havent a clue.
olds: I would agree.

Bailout

Those platforms came from Ford of Europe where used by Mazda before Ford NA used them. Also Ford’s quality is higher than Mazda’s so how will dropping Mazda hurt Ford????

Carstuff makes an excellent point. Trucks do skew the numbers. Re badged Mercurys score higher than Ford in these ratings and that is because Merc does not sell Ranger F150 or Super Duty.