April24
Aside from matching BMW’s feat of squeezing 500 horsepower from a 5.0-liter naturally aspirated V10, Honda has set an ambitious goal of achieving 23.5 mpg from the engine that will power its new Acura NSX.
According to Winding Road magazine, new rumors out of Japan indicate Honda executives set the goal for engineers of the new supercar, which should debut at the Tokyo Motor Show this fall. The vehicle is expected to achieve a 0.0 km/l rating (equal to 23.5 mpg) using Japan’s standard 10.15-mode fuel cycle. The 276 hp NSX Type R with a 3.2-liter V6 manages a less impressive 8.6 km/l.
The new NSX is expected to be based on the Advanced Sports Car Concept, however a recent report claimed Honda had gone back to the drawing board to make the design more distinctive.
cant wait to see how they are going to do it. it is definitely possible though, especially since the Corvette gets great gas mileage for such a high hp V-8
^yeah josh i was thinking the same and with 2 liters less displacement this should be easily doable, especially for honda..
The engine and mpg sound great, but the body style does need to be more recognizeable. Perhaps another midengine?
josh,
The vette gets good mpg (18/28)IF you lug it in 6th gear around 1200 rpm. Who the hell buys a Vette then lugs it?
The 911 actually gets better city and within 2mpg hiway compared to the vette. (19/26)
The M5 is way behind the curve at 12/18.
23.5 is a high bar to clear considering the S2000 barely meets that.
First Honda has to design a much better car than what its concept looks like. Seriously the NSX was very nice and the HSC was awsome too. Also artists renderings looked very very good. however the advanced sports car concept is one ugly ass piece of ****. I was very very disapionted when i saw it specially as its former concept looked so nice.
Whoa, 23.5mpg? Stop the presses!
*rolls eyes*
doesn’t the 350Z get 28mpg hwy? isn’t that car fast? How fast do you need to go anyways, aren’t cars capped somewhere around 110MPH by a governor?? My buddy showed me his Rumble Bee and said the governor topped the speed to 105mph. I like cars, but i don’t see the point in going faster. I’m stuck in traffic all the time anyways. I’m just rambling, fuggedaboutit.
Maximus-
there are things called tracks
The reason the honda S2000 only gets 25 mpg on the highway is because how it is geared. Yes, it is only a 4 cyclinder, but also the cam profile to make that much power from a N/A motor requires more fuel. When I am cruising on the highway, I am at about 4400-4700 RPM. Whereas a V6 or V8 will maybe running 1800-2800RPM. There is alot more to fuel economy than just engine size. Also, the federal government limits all factory cars to 155mph. If it is set any lower, it is because the manufacturer set it there.
MPG isn’t a concern to NSX fans. Just keep it mid engined and RWD like the old one!!
The gov’t doesn’t limit cars to 155mph.
“How fast do you need to go anyways, aren’t cars capped somewhere around 110MPH by a governor??”
Is this guy for real?
Gotta love Honda. While GM is blaming the government for canning its RWD project, Honda is pushing a standard that will advance both the environment and autosports.
No, the 350z isn’t fast. Why doesn’t honda just use GM’s LS7? It fits their goals and is better than anything they could ever build.
Honda needs to get over its hatred of turbochargers. They’re coming into an era where gas mileage is getting more important than it has ever been and yet they are still using marketing campaigns that stress the “high performance”, “efficiency” and “sportscar nature” of their cars.
guardianofall hit it on the nose: it’s the short gearing that limits the mileage of their cars. I love short geared and high revving engines but I also love torque and impressive horsepower.
You want a supercar engine with 500 horsepower that is low displacement, naturally aspirated, geared to be fast and gets very good gas mileage?
I think the real reason we won’t be getting the Civic Type RR is because it will get the gas mileage of an RX-7.
…but Honda hates turbos, so what can we expect of their “sports” cars in the future? Probably more variations on gas-electric IMA drivetrains. If that’s the direction they want to go in, a pure electric is more appealing to me. At least then you would have a good base to modify the electrical system to put more power to the motors.
When are they going to build the next NSX - this is the third concept to my memory. By the time they build the ASC it’ll be more like the Seriously Outdated Sports Car.
“Honda hates turbos…”
What about the RDX?
Bring back the mid-engine configuration just like Audi’s R8 because there is nothing exotic about a lxurious GT car.
“The gov’t doesn’t limit cars to 155mph.”
There’s always a third world country somewhere with decent freeway that has no speed limits nor speed limiter. You can race and piss off other cars all day with the only consequence being your life on the line.
Honda rulz!
Honda doesn’t necessarily hate turbos. What Honda values more than anything else is reliability. This above all is the foundation of Honda’s reputation. While turbos are great at making power and torque, they also have a reliability and maintenance profile that puts them outside of Honda’s parameters.
) We’ll see in a couple of years how the well the RDX engine does. If it succeeds, expect to see more turbo engines across the Honda range. In particular, a turbo would work extremely well with hybrid engines.
With the RDX, however, Honda may have figured out making turbos as reliable as their normally asperated engines (either that, or they’ve lowered their standards
global_lightning - the difference is that Honda still has a blank sheet of paper. GM was a lot closer to production on their RWD platform and it is a lot harder to change direction. You know this. Honda has been teasing everyone with all these concepts of the NSX. They get everyone drooling, turn around and hand you a paper towel before they tell you they’re not building it.
“Honda needs to get over its hatred of turbochargers.”
That’s an ignorant statement. Automakers generally stick with tradition. Keeping with that line of thinking, you could say BMW hated turbos… until the 330 twin turbo. Or that Mercedes hated turbos, till the twin turbo monsters in the Maybach and E class sedans. And the new RDX does have a turbo. A variable vane unit similar4 to the ones in the new Porsche 911.
Honda makes jet engines… they even have a Hybrid engined snow blower sold in the Japanese market for Christ’s sake. These guys know engineering, as proven by consistently getting over 100 hp per liter in it’s mainstream engines, while maintaining really god gas mileage and low emissions. Still think Honda hates turbos? Well, there were some notorious turbo’d Hondas driven by some dudes named Senna and Prost… and that was way back when. I’d bet they’ve learned a thing or two since then.
My ‘02 Z06 with simple bolt-on mods including cold air intake, long tube headers, cat back exhaust, and dyno tuning gets 33 MPG on the highway and AVERAGES 26 MPG with about 30-40% city driving, while also having plenty of full throttle acceleration runs (i.e. it would get even better average mileage if I babied it). All while putting out 450hp.
When it was bone stock at 405hp, it consistently got 28 MPG highway, and 23 average.
Maybe Honda should consider a large displacement pushrod motor to meet their fuel economy goals
It’s actually pretty easy if you keep the weight and RPM’s down. The NSX is supposed to be light weight, like the Corvette, so they should achieve their goals. They just need to make sure the engine has enough low end torque to use a tall 6th gear to keep the RPM’s down (something small displacement engines generally aren’t good at).
And the person who commented that the Corvette’s fuel economy is only achieved by “lugging it” has no idea what he’s talking about and obviously has never driven one. While you’re certainly not going to win any acceleration contests in 6th gear at 65 mph and 1,200 RPM’s, the engine is not lugging at all, and still has plenty of torque to climb very steep grades without downshifting to 5th. Try that with a small displacement DOHC engine, and you would be lugging it.
“Comment by jamaicandude, posted on April25 at 12:00 pm Honda makes jet engines… ”
Uh, no they don’t. GE makes the jet engines for Honda through a joint venture. And actually, they’re not even in production yet. Honda knows better than to try to design and produce a jet engine by themselves.
“These guys know engineering, as proven by consistently getting over 100 hp per liter in it’s mainstream engines, while maintaining really god gas mileage and low emissions. ”
If you’re referring to the Honda S2000 engine, it’s fuel economy is piss poor for its size and power output. Don’t confuse specific power output efficiency with fuel efficiency. They are not the same. Rotaries are even better with specific power output, but they are absolutely horrible in terms of fuel efficiency. Same with 2-cycle engines.
I still don’t think the new NSX will be based on the ASC concept.. especially if they plan to continue to call it the NSX. I’m thinking the HSC concept has (hopefully) been evolved into the NSX, and the ASC will actually become a replacement for the S2000, and maybe given to Acura as well (new RSX?) since the styling is supposed to be the precursor to future Acura models.
Z06ified,
I wasn’t talking about the F20/F22 in the S2K. Both the B16A and B18C, and also the H22A from the Accord Euro R acheived 100hp/liter status. And the K20A in the ITR/RSX does as well. The fuel economy on those cars is very good compared to their size and power output. And most new Hondas achieve LEV status.
Also, you’ll get relatively poor gas mileage in any vehicle if you drive it flat out all the time. Even Hybrids and diesels. The same applies to Honda engines as well. Why do you think GM had the skip-shift feature on a lot of it’s V8 cars? It was to get good EPA mileage figures and beat gas guzzler taxes. Keep a B or K series off the big cams though, and the fuel economy is great. I’ve owned every DOHC VTEC engine in some Honda or another, with the exception of the NSX and S2K, and always enjoyed great gas mileage.
Also, the jet engine venture is a 50/50 deal between GE and Honda. It’s an entirely new (in 2004) company called GE Honda Aero Engines, and the first ones are slated for production this year. They’ve been testing for months now. GE doesn’t make the engines for Honda.
PS. I know the engines won’t be in any production aircraft till at least 2010.