Comments on: Lutz Interview, Part 1: Camaro began as “pure concept;” mum on Z28

By: hbcbob3

hbcbob3 — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 18:11:12 +0000

@Raineman: It’s been 40+ years, and roughly 7 years off for the Camaro, and the ****stang still can beat them…I guarantee you. Ford ****ing sucks my nutsack.

By: global_lightning

global_lightning — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 15:23:50 +0000

New Camaro = Automotive Vaporware

By: olds307

olds307 — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 04:03:05 +0000

As long as you can turn on the windshield wipers with the window open without getting a left knee full of water, unlike the 90s F-bodies, it looks good to me.

By: Get Real

Get Real — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 02:24:23 +0000

PBS did a big interview with Lutz about 2 weeks ago.
The man has no fire in his belly, how can he run a company ??

By: Dodge_fanatic9

Dodge_fanatic9 — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 00:27:42 +0000

wat there making a new camaro? why didnt anyone tell me 5 years ago…. oh wait lol

By: beatusmongous

beatusmongous — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 23:19:20 +0000

Okay, so 116 hp? Or is it the electric motor getting 107 hp? It’s still less than 210 hp, and the torque still drops off at the same point. The 40 hp boost is good for maybe 1 second on the track.

Oh, and you can’t combine the electric and gas hp numbers. They hit at different RPM levels, much like a bi-turbo. It’s good for a smoother torque curve, but it still won’t touch the Mustang or Camaro. It will beat a base Civic, though.

By: crackerhemi

crackerhemi — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 23:10:44 +0000

beatus:

I am talking about the new prius, which should get 40+ more HP, and much more torque.

By: beatusmongous

beatusmongous — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 22:51:17 +0000

Prius 76 hp @ 5000 rpm (gas) < Mustang 210 hp @ 5300 rpm

Prius 82 lb.-ft. @ 4200 rpm (gas) < Mustang 240 lb.-ft. @ 3500 rpm

Prius 67 hp @ 1200-1540 rpm (electric) Mustang 240 lb.-ft. @ 3500 rpm

Here’s what all this means: The Prius can get a nice jump, since max torque is put out at 0 rpm. But once it hits 1,200 rpm, that max torque drops out. Meanwhile, the Mustang is just starting to reach its max torque. Now, that’s assuming everything is happening in one gear. But it’s not…

No, the Prius has a CVT, which is a rubber-band like transmission, instead of gears. A CVT is designed to work by keeping the RPMs pinned at maximum torque and letting the transmission do the work. However, anyone who’s ever driven a car with a CVT knows that the theory doesn’t work in practice. Instead, the CVT pins the RPMs at the highest level, just before redline, and it doesn’t quite give you maximum torque. The Mustang, however, is geared to stay within its “powerband” as much as possible. What ends up happening in practice is that the Prius passes its powerband, and the CVT pins it in a low-torque, high-RPM level, while the Mustang is shifting through its high-torque, high-RPM powerband.

Now here’s the fun part: The Prius gets max torque at 0 RPM, but the Mustang reaches it at 3,500 RPM. So, the Prius driver will not hit the accelerator until he is given the “go”. However, the Mustang driver will rev up to 3,500 RPM, and drop the clutch on the “go”, giving both cars max torque from the start. Once the Prius gets some speed, and gets past 1,200 RPM, the torque drops off, and the Mustang will leave the Prius in the dust. It’s no contest. That is why the Prius, with 295 lb.-ft. of torque, gets only an 18 second 1/4 mile, and the Mustang does it in 15 or less.

Heck, my 4,400 lb. Nissan Minivan with 240 hp and 235 lb.-ft. of torque gets a better 1/4 mile time than a Prius, although that isn’t saying much. However, it is a good 3 seconds faster…

By: crackerhemi

crackerhemi — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 22:13:33 +0000

When the prius is pumping out more HP and torque than your puny “American Muscle,” having a Z28 model for a wannabe sports car isn’t such a bad idea.

By: injunraiv

injunraiv — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 21:18:51 +0000

‘Only one’? The Camaro faced the Mustang, Cuda/Challenger, AMX/Javelin, and Firebird, just to name a few. Throw in the Nova class, and there was plenty of competition back in the day.

The scary thing about this article? It says ‘Part 1′…

By: johnnycanuck

johnnycanuck — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 20:45:15 +0000

I’d be a little nervous if I were Lutz. Yes they do have a lot riding on the Camaro and they’re going back to do battle in a niche where there are now 3 other players, if you include the Genesis coupe, instead of only one as it was during the Camaro’s last go around. If GM’s going to push the lower performance variants then they’re betting a hell of a lot that the look of the Camaro alone will draw customers.

By: d00d

d00d — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 20:34:25 +0000

According to GM, the Camaro SS automatic is 400hp and 3913lbs (9.78lbs/hp), and Chrysler lists the Challenger SRT automatic at 425hp and 4140lbs (9.74lbs/hp). I can’t find any weight data for a manual SRT yet, and the SS manual has 422hp, but it looks like the automatic versions are closely matched.

By: HemiRoadRunner

HemiRoadRunner — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 20:05:17 +0000

The camaro needs to be a PERFORMANCE CAR!!! NOT an economy car, that’s what the POS cruze and beat is for.

By: RaineMan

RaineMan — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 19:58:28 +0000

I seriously doubt the new Camaro is faster than the SRT-8 Challenger. Heck… it was only a few seconds faster than the Cobalt SS around the ‘ring. It’s pretty pathetic for a 400hp “muscle car” to get beaten out by an amped up FWD econobox like Cobalt. I’m just itchin to run one on the streets.

By: brassmonkey

brassmonkey — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 19:56:43 +0000

Thank you, LLN. I have been going through withdrawals from not having a Camaro to read about.

By: Vosotros

Vosotros — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 19:18:35 +0000

I can’t imagine GM would let the Z28 moniker die… I’m sure they’ve got something tucked up their sleeves, though probably not what we’re expecting.

The new Camaro looks great – and while I do agree that it’s a touch behind the times on the musclecar band wagon, look what GM has done with the Chevy HHR. It’s basically a Chrysler PT Cruiser with a little more room inside – and GM has marketed the hell out of it with interesting variants like the panel wagon (I see a TON of those around here in Baltimore) and the new SS version. I bet GM can pull it off… I hope!!

By: d00d

d00d — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 19:13:44 +0000

GM may be doing a `Milton Berle’ with the new Camaro.
There’s a story where Milton let out only enough to win a tool length contest …if you get what I mean.
They may be waiting on releasing the Z28 version, because the SS already comfortably out performs the nearest competitor, the Challenger SRT.
I’m not counting the Mustang, as it’s solid rear axle is appropriate for a truck or drag racer, but not a modern road going muscle car.

By: F451

F451 — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 19:11:40 +0000

Would have been much better had the team that actually made the Camaro was interviewed versus Lutz who is useless.

By: howsmydriving

howsmydriving — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 19:03:53 +0000

It’ll be very, very interesting to see how Camaro lands.

By: Rick_WagonWheel

Rick_WagonWheel — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 18:34:45 +0000

HRR,

I think Lutz could be handing you one right about now.

From my Ren-Cen office.

By: RaineMan

RaineMan — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 18:26:12 +0000

The Camaro is bloated and past it’s time… just like Lutz. Two years earlier and 500lbs lighter this would have been a mean machine and excellent Mustang competition. Even with 400hp it’ll never measure up to the likes of Mustang.

By: JoshyLofty

JoshyLofty — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 18:17:57 +0000

i hate chevy but the camaro is amazing to look at.