If GM doesn’t build this they will have more negative equity in peoples perceptions than Enron. I really hope for their sake that they build this, that it’s cheap, and that it’s out before the competition can one up them.

150MPG?? production by 2012??? yeah and by next week we’all be living on mars and we’ll each have our own time travel capable space ships. shut up Bob Putz

Hey homeboy, how old are you? 12?

GM has promised alot over the years. After so long everything just sounds like fluff.

They should just throw another “Road to Redemption” campaign out there while they’re at it. As if people actually fall for it anymore.

It won’t be cheap, new technology never is. But at 150mpg it’s hard not to justify a premium. If they don’t build it, it will be VERY negative for their image. If they do however, this may be GM’s salvation.

Wickeddated,
Keep in mind that although this will be new technology it will have the, supposedly, full might of GM behind it. They have more leveraging power than all but Toyota and if used wisely I see no reason this vehicle should be able to fall under the average car price. A stripped out model for basic commuting would be very tempting to many commuters, college students, and city dwellers.

If they can do this I’ll be blown away

I’d like to see them pull it off.

“on a 60 mile trip the car would average 150mpg”- I don’t get it.

BUILD IT! Make sure it can push an 8.5 second 0-60 so it doesn’t turn off people who are concerned about safe acceleration (like me), offer a base trim with the usual show car wheels and what not toned down at a competitive price, and offer a sport package that looks EXACTLY like the concept. It would blow Prius and other hybrids out of the water, and I myself would be very interested. Imagine if 95% of the gas you had to buy was the tank-a-month for your weekend V8 =)

Hoosier - The first 40 miles would be electric only, so it would only travel 20 miles on gas, and wouldn’t even use half a gallon.

GM is capable of doing great things, but before they can they need some executive housekeeping. Who knows what GM will release in 2010 in the way of advanced technology, but I do believe they will release something as everyone else out there is doing so.

Sure would offset GM’s drunken thirst for gas guzzling V8’s. I’d be very hesitant to buy new technology from GM as I have been burned by “all new” GM product in the past. Give it a generation or two to work all the bugs out.

Like it or not, more people are willing to go for the Prius or japanese hybrids as they have history and a solid reputation for being durable. That’s a hurdle that GM won’t be able to overcome.

wickedated GM is beyond salvation they dont have a hope in hell of pulling this off. they should just quit while they are behind

Durable?? I know someone who was in a 10mph fender bender in a Prius and the engine dropped off its mounts!

And that means squat to the buying public. Not representative of real world. Just a war story.

If they offer it in RWD with at least 250hp, a 6-speed manual and a double wishbone suspension front and back, I am interested.

I am personally going to guess front-biased AWD, 190ish hp, and a 5-speed manual or 5-speed automatic option.

lol, GM manual boxes are clunky, notchy junk. The Krappa cars are stuck with one from a Colorado pickup truck and it blows, big time. Top that off with the lack of demand and current slushboxes getting better mileage than sticks, expect an Automatic if this even happens.

“Durable?? I know someone who was in a 10mph fender bender in a Prius and the engine dropped off its mounts!”

…yeah sure. and i know someone who stole a space shuttle and is flying to pluto right now. these sort of comments serve no purpose except to show that you, PrimeGTP, dislike the prius. unless you have an article you can refer us to stop making stupid claims cause i can sit here and do the same thing

AWD will hamper those hopes and dreams of fuel economy.

It’ll be a bare bones, no frills econobox. With GM, it’s big dreams, little delivery. That’s just what we’re used to.

Traditional manuals are dying, no doubt about it. Doesn’t help that GM’s FWD manuals are crap. I personally thought the Solstice’s 5-speed wasn’t bad, but that’s a matter of opinion I suppose. I tested a 6-speed manual 3.9L GTP and a 6-speed ,shiftable auto 3.6L GTP and never looked back when I went with the automatic. Eventually, dual-clutch gearboxes will be cheaper and that will be all we see.

Volt may still see a manual though, can’t tell. My money is on a 5-speed automatic though, unless they kick production of the 6-speed automatic in high gear and start mating it to other engines.

You are trapped, I think, in the late 90s and GM’s general attitude towards consumers at that point in time. Lately when GM says they want to build something, they do it. Some have been misses. The Buick Supers come to mind, which are just ways of using up the supply of crappy old DTS and Grand Prix GXP powertrains that are horribly outdated. But with the G8 and Camaro going into production almost devoid of changes from the original designs, the Cobalt SS ditching its supercharger for a much better turbo set up, the new work-of-art CTS, and interior quality making big strides (though still some ways to go), the General Motors that has existed since around 2004 is a marked improvement.

I’d expect the 6 speed to be overkill here. That extra cog is a weight detriment. A traditional 5 speed or GM “staple” 4 speed is a more likely choice. Maybe we’ll even see a reuse of those polymer panels Saturn used to heve.

I agree the 5-speed is most likely. I think GM is finally waking up and looking to move away from the ancient 4-speeds that plague many of the entry-level cars, so I would be surprised if that was used.

Its all about style, I think the concept looks great, unlike the other hybrids out there. If it has power and handling as well it will change the automotive world as we know it….someone has to.

The G8 is a low volume Aussie, not representative of GM shooting for the core of the market. The Camaro is a 3 year old concept that is still another 3 years out. Sure, it’ll get here, but nobody is going to care anymore. Old news…

The Cobalt lost the Supercharger for a Turbo. Big deal. Sounds like cost cutting because to keep uniformity with the Krappa cars. How bout a much needed interior upgrade? How about fixing the dismal reliability ratings or the reliance on fleets?

The CTS is not “state of the art” by any means. It is a needed upgrade from the cheapo one that is out there now. The Aura was hyped on the curcuit as GM’s interior renaissance but the actual production was hacked apart by the beancounters. The car is underwhelming and on track to sell half of it’s projected target. Big promise, short on delivery.

No, I think I am legit in my opinion of GM. There is nothing special or groundbreaking about them. 3 decades won’t be forgiven overnight.

What does low volume have to do with something being a good product or not? I suppose the only cars we should ever talk about are Accords and Camrys.

Cobalt will likely gain around 40hp from the powertrain switch, so I wouldn’t knock it. And yes, the Deltas are due for a new generation, but rumor has it 2009 MY will be that year.

Sounds to me like you are stretching for excuses, not objectively analysing. Understandable, because no one likes to let go of long-held perceptions. Just pointing out that if you are going to slag off GM cars for silly reasons, you should do the same for all the others.

everybody is talking about acceleration and looks….listen to me if any car company can pull 150mpg it doesnt matter what it looks like or how it accelerates. PEOPLE ARE GONNA BUY IT. Think about what commericial business would pay to have a car that gets 150mpg. You guys are missing the point, check your news station gas isnt going down.

All I care about is that it isn’t Prius-slow, because I consider that dangerous in emergencies.

The radio show was a hoot. Too bad he didn’t get any questions right. Trivia just isn’t his thing. Too busy running GM, I guess.

GM has come a long way in only ten years. Having the bottom nearly fall out from Detroit in the last four of five years really brought that to light. They’ve shown the most significant and most overall improvement and I think they will only continue back up.

The cool thing about electric motors is that they really don’t need transmissions. But current motors are not really powerful enough to get the speeds, not the acceleration - that they do much better, that IC engines do. But a couple of decades of competition will change that. Most transmissions equipped to electric motors will have four or less gears and no reverse (don’t need it). this would be less expensive and save weight as well.

The gearing of an IC engine is such that is needed to take advantage of the torque band, which falls off pretty badly early in the rev range. More gears usually translates to higher maximum speeds and better f/econ.

This is a thing many people are crowing about with Toyota’s offering an eight speed tranny: More speed, better f/econ… even if you can’t have it both ways at the same time. with motors it is largely the same thing but is mainly so the motor can attain higher maximum speeds, though not by that much greater a priority.

This is a different story with parallel hybrids like the Prius, which uses it’s small underpowered ICE as main propulsion needing the motors for boost. the engine needing more gears to keep the car moving at an acceptable pace.

Because motors do their job better, and will improve with competition, than IC engines they require fewer gears and so I would submit that the Volt will not have more than four gears. It just won’t need it.

I would swap the motor in the VOLT for the one in the TESLA roadster, even if it hurts my F/econ to run the generator more frequently. I’d still smoke any other Hybrid (until maybe the FT-HS and the LS600h hits) until then… enjoy the rise of muscle hybrids.

Well PrimeGTP having better acceleration is better than not, but I can’t remeber any accident I seen or been in were have better acceleration would have helped much. Better braking matter way more in terms of performance saftey.

The Prius isn’t slow but still, what does that matter anyways? “Dangerous in Emergency’s” lol aren’t we just a wee bit hysterical here? It’s a commuter transportation, not a racecar. Look at the Honda Accord hybrid. Quicker and more powerful than a regular V6 Accord, yet the model was a slow seller. The Camry hybrid and Prius sell in droves comparably.

You’re just being overly critical of the car because it’s a Toyota. The public has voted with their wallets and the Prius is a success. Success that GM only wishes they had right now.

Some people would rather avoid the accident rather than stop and wait for it to happen to them. But Braking is important too. Also, when merging on the highway, spending ten-plus seconds to get to 60 or in some ares 70+mph is very dangerous and unsettling for all involved. Being able to get a move on is every bit a major safety performance concern as braking and is handling.

if it looked this good and got 150 mpg i would trade my nissan for one no problem.
Garbage motors, primeGTP said “work of art” not “state of the art” there is a big difference there bro.

“Muscle hybrids” lol. Love it.

And GTP, I wasn’t looking at volume being the main criteria. Merley pointing at the fact the G8 is projected to sell 30k cars. A mere drop in the bucket… Add to the fact that the car is nothing more than an Aussie derivative and it proves that GM is still living in their “badge engineering” ways of yore. Touting it as some breakthrough wondurkar from GM is unconvincing. The public perception isn’t going to be swayed one bit.

If I am “stretching for excuses” then we’ll see just how successful the new G8 is when it arrives. Because based on the last Aussie offering, GM is 0 for 1 with that idea.

IT WON’T HAVE A TRANSMISSION, IDIOTS.

The wheels will be driven directly by electric motors, and the sole purpose of the gas motor will be to charge the battery. That’s it. Motors at the front wheels. No transmission necessary because of the nature of electric motors.

“Garbage motors, primeGTP said “work of art” not “state of the art” there is a big difference there bro.”

My bad then. “Work of art” then, but looks are subjective. The Saturn Aura was a work of art in some cases too (More GM not slapping a cheap interior into a car for once but I digress) and it’s disappointing. Looks decent, but cheap bits a plenty. Buick Enclave was another “beauty”. Haven’t seen the production one in person, but I’ve read some accounts of “cost cutting” in the auto rags.

Just my opinion btw.

“Some people would rather avoid the accident rather than stop and wait for it to happen to them. But Braking is important too. Also, when merging on the highway, spending ten-plus seconds to get to 60 or in some ares 70+mph is very dangerous and unsettling for all involved. Being able to get a move on is every bit a major safety performance concern as braking and is handling.”

Exactly, thank you Blakkarr.

And Garbage, you answered your own question. I do not criticize the Accord hybrid because it is not slow. I criticize the Prius because it is slow. I hope I do not have to explain this 1st grade logic to you.

GarbageMotorsCo,

I think you are right everyone is jealous of the Prius and it’s success, but I think that the truth surrounding the Prius is starting to show and it is that the Prius, as it’s name entail is the first, and far from the best. The public wants something better, something with a future. the Parallel hybrid is like the supercharger and the Turbo, just a booster who has the side effect of better f/econ.

But the real future that I think is better served by Serial hybrids, which GM is pursuing visibly now, and Honda is visibly reaching further along with Fuel Cells, which takes the engine further out of the equation and forces development of technologies that Parallels don’t need improvements in. Improvements that is the long run will make the ICE obsolete as the main source of locomotion in an automobile.

As to sales, I won’t argue. I think Honda frequently fails to push their product adequately, even if their’s are actually better than Toyota’s. Besides, you have to look at teh percentage of units made sold. If Honda set out to build and sell only 100,000 units and sold 90,000 (90%) while Toyota built 500,000 and sold only 250,000 (50%) guess who is actually doing better.

Toyota is having real trouble moving their hybrids which is one reason why Toyota has made the very uncharacteristic move to place TV ads for the Prius. and I still don’t see very many Camry or Lexus Hybrids (I can go two weeks and see only two or three - usually the same two or three).

You are not entirely mistaken but I think that you’re view is bit simplistic or else you would be more aware that not every one just wants a car that will get them from work or school or where ever and back again. It has been said that cars are more about sex appeal, beings sleek fast, and agile. I think more people are more inclined to wait for a sexy car than buy the practical one already out. Now if a practical but very sexy car comes along, that will sell like crucifixes during the inquisition.

Lutz is all talk talk talk.

No product to revolutionize GM has come out in years.

Lutz is collecting his paycheck and flying his planes while GM is sinking.

Time to crash the ship into the rocks and take on the unions, rebuild what is left of GM and make the world admire GM product again.

youngm7,

Don’t get upset, cars like that are being developed now, mostly by small firms and colleges. The power requirements still outstrip most practical generators system, forget fuel cells and batteries. Taking R/C racing models (again) as an example, models with multiple drive motors have badly reduces run times, usually less than half.

But in-hub motors still have more problems, such as unsprung weight. This is the weight of the vehicle that isn’t being supported by the springs in the suspension. The motors would weight at least 30lbs each. This results in poor handling and steering control. These concerns and others are keeping this ultimate solution, and I think it is the ultimate solution - in time, from coming up now to market.

PrimeGTP the engine drops out of its mounts for safety, the Mini does the same thing

“The G8 is a low volume Aussie, not representative of GM shooting for the core of the market. The Camaro is a 3 year old concept that is still another 3 years out. Sure, it’ll get here, but nobody is going to care anymore. Old news…”
“And GTP, I wasn’t looking at volume being the main criteria. Merley pointing at the fact the G8 is projected to sell 30k cars. A mere drop in the bucket… Add to the fact that the car is nothing more than an Aussie derivative and it proves that GM is still living in their “badge engineering” ways of yore. Touting it as some breakthrough wondurkar from GM is unconvincing. The public perception isn’t going to be swayed one bit.

If I am “stretching for excuses” then we’ll see just how successful the new G8 is when it arrives. Because based on the last Aussie offering, GM is 0 for 1 with that idea.”

Firstly, do you have a clue as to how brand advertising works? It’s driven by being repetitive. More advertising correlates to greater success. Pepsi was the most widely recognized brand name in the world because of their advertising. The same can be said of the Camaro. Just because you and I, and the rest of us who religiously follow industry news, know about it, doesn’t mean that the other 98% of the population does too.

Secondly, part of GM’s strategy is diversity. They have a broader range of vehicles than any manufacturer. And, to your credit, many times it’s a detriment. Albeit in the vast majority of cases it’s been good for the company. That said, Pontiac is a niche brand. 30,000 sales is a good start for a brand re-emerging in the performance market. But this is not merely a rebadge. This is great GM property being introduced to the North American market. Call the G5 and Torrent rebadges, that’s fine. But this is different. There’s nothing to ’see-through’ here. Your analysis would be true ten years ago. But holding old stereotypes is naive.

By the way, take off your blinders, the GTO is a good car. Marketing just dropped the ball on the nameplate.

From everything I’ve read, it appears that this car really isn’t for me. It’s a huge step in the right direction for the company’s environmental stance, but it’s all econobox. I’ll wait for later models that keep with the environmentally friendly electric drivetrain but in a proper orientation to the rear wheels.

Souse, at 10MPH? Uh, no.

GM is going to build this?

They can’t even build a set of radio buttons that don’t look like they belong on a FisherPrice toy. What a joke. Good riddance losers, the day this comes out is the day Fastrat admits his sexual orientation (gay).

im not believing it until you can actually get into a store and buy one…

GTO a good car ??

I have read there are UNTITLED 2005 and 2006 GTO’s still on the lot to buy.

3 letters attached to the butt of a crap design has nothing to do with marketing.

GM should have had made it an inexpensive car stuffed with a V8.

BUT the Corvette must remain top dog at GM.

I would ask what you would think of it if, instead of offering the G6, they had come out with the GTO as the Grand Am’s replacement. But there’s too many variables to that question. For simplicities sake, the GTO (if renamed Grand Am or G6) would be one badass replacement of the two-door GA. I’d be praising Pontiac for such a dramatic upgrade. But I could be horribly wrong. Maybe naming it GTO was the only way it got as much attention as it did.

Well, the GTO certainly was better than the G6. It was cited in many auto rags as having one of, if not thee nicest interior design and materials to ever come out of GM. I know that’s not saying much but still, if I had the choice between the GTO and the G6, I’d take the Goat without batting an eye.

The G6 is a disaster, easily the cheapest, chinziest car in the GM stable. Well, next to the MonteCarlo with doors that sound like windflaps when you shut them…

Still, the G6 was an ultra disappointment, hyped up as a viable competitor next to the outgoing joke they called Grand MA yet it came screaming out of the gate with

200hp pushrod and a 4-speed slushbox… yay. Essentially, we got a reincarnation of a POS Cavalier. Wonder why buyers are so used to being let down by General Motors…

All GM has to do is distribute this technology to more conservative vehicles (malibus, auras, etc) and they’ll be WAY better off.

At the end of the day, the Volt is “ugly”. Ugly as in way too flashy for 95% of car buyers.