The GOP has no credibillity, no leadership, and no leaders are on the horizon
DrFill

think of him what you will… he is right about this. chapter 11 doesnt mean the company is dead and buried afterwards. it actually IS a last parachute to help them get their stuff right. if they cant get things done then, they really, really really deserve no better than having their plug pulled… sorry for all the workers and their families, but a last effort is a last effort. (and this actually is more than anyone else gets…!)

I agree with him, GM is in too bad of shape to recover.

cant argue with this, GM needs massive restructuring. GM should be getting their loans from banks for all of this and only if they cant get bank loans should the government be stpping in to loan GM money for restructuring. But this will never happen because chapter 11 would break ties to UAW and Obama is in bed with the unions so he’ll do everything he can to keep that from happening.

with that said… poor GM

This sucks that we have already given them money and now they have to file for Chapter 11. They are a ****ty company that makes ****ty products that are inferior to the competetition so whats the best course of action …Give them a loan GREAT
Let these assholes go bankrupt and I would love to see where the bailout money went Some CEO is living high on the horse
By the way John Mc Cain looks like he played football with a leather helmet

Did mccain have any friends high up in GM?
No?
Well **** it, let ‘em fail then.

I concur with fan. This is not ideological issue. We can tax ourselves to death for this fiasco, generate inflation along with depression, but if at the end of the day there is no reason for GM to produce cars/trucks that are not accepted in the marketplace what the point of tossing good money after bad?

I’d much rather spend MY tax money on manufacturing than a f**king bank or insurance co.
Give GM some of the 130billion flushed down the toilet to AIG.

he doesnt know what the hell he is talking about. yea i agree leaner, stronger, better is all good but if you are a potential car buyer, would you ever consider a car from a company that has been filed for chapter 11? think about it

“I’d much rather spend MY tax money on manufacturing than a f**king bank or insurance co.
Give GM some of the 130billion flushed down the toilet to AIG.”

Exactly. Give GM as much money as they need. It is our obligation to keep the spine of America from folding. If GM goes under, this Country will be far beyond what you see in the third world. It will be an economic wastland with rioting, looting, huge upswings in violence and mass chaos. America will fall far from grace. Just like it is our obligations as Americans to buy American products like those from GM, it is up to our gov’t to ensure their survival. If it means a blank check, then give it to them. They deserve it. Any of you buffoons who don’t agree should move to Sushi-land or just stfu.

What’s good for General Motors is good for this Country.

McCain is a babling idiot who doesn’t have a clue what he is proposing.

Originally I thought “flailing Auto Industry” was just a typo, but it actually works!!! It only applies to the Chrysler and Ford companies though. We all know what needs to happen at Genrral Motors and they are the only company with a clear mission. The other 1.5 can fail for all we care. They have produced a lot of low quality, sub-par vehicles for far too long and need to go. it will only make GM stronger if they do.

Buy American. Buy GM. It is your duty

Well, I guess we have the right leadership in place to take over manufacturing facilities and US government will be in charge of GM. Hopefully everyone who works for GM will be pleased with government classification and salaries. I would not have issues with Wagoner making $90K as government supervisor and every salesman making 28K as a low experience/education clerk.

Funny how Presidents Bush and (then President-Elect) Obama each suggested structured government shepherded Chapter 11 for GM before Congress made more stimulus money available.

Circumstances under which GM and Chrysler find themselves are precisely why Chapter 11 re-organization exists.

United and Delta sought Chapter 11 bankruptcy relief from creditors and it didn’t stop passengers from buying airline tickets.

K-Mart went into bankruptcy after which it merged with Sears Roebuck.

Conseco Insurance didn’t stop selling insurance because it filed for bankruptcy.

In the previous 30 years during which GM lost over 50% of its US marketshare, GM hadn’t filed for Chapter 11 protection one time. Pontiac, a company which sold nearly 800,000 cars per year domestically back in the early 1980s sold just over 300,000 in 2006. Yet half as many consumers were.

A GM that used to have 500,000 US based employees 3 decades ago now has barely 120,000, and that number is going down. It’s US operations are the shell of the company it once was. Yet it is saddled with financial obligation that date back to its when it held a 60% market share in the US.

GM needs to find private investment capital to keep the company a “going concern.” $20 billion in government loans won’t be enough to guarantee viability. At $1.00 per share that GM stock is currently selling at, institutional investors won’t touch stock in a company saddled with all that “old or legacy debt”. Through bankruptcy GM can significantly reduce its “legacy debt”. Then if institutional investors are convinced that the right management is in place and the company has some truly viable products, investors will start buying stock again.

McCain is right on this one.

Since when did McCain become an expert on GM finances? If this is his support, then why doesn’t he buy American and not forgein? The day after he lost the election he drove out of his hotel in a large Toyota SUV. Nice, McCain, very nice. Thanks for serving America and Japan!

While I absolutely loathed the idea of McCain as President… I do agree with many of the things he has to say as a Senator. There are a lot of companies that have been on life support for the past year… it’s time to pull the plug.

NMOFGM – “We all know what needs to happen at Genrral Motors and they are the only company with a clear mission.” Tell me, what is that? Enlighten me.

NMORGM is an idiot. let us all ignore him.

NMOFGM is back ! nothing like starting the week with a good laugh

Philjo: it has been widely reported that McCain’s personal car is a Cadillac CTS. Just because he’s seen in a vehicle doesn’t mean he owns it.

McCain us wright…
NMOGM is wrong….as usual!!

Why isn’t John McCain suspending his job as senator and running off to Detroit to solve the problem? That type of grandstanding worked SO well during the election.

I’m so glad I didn’t vote for this dumbass…

One of his major ‘problems’ in my eyes was that during his bid to be president, he repeatedly said he didn’t understand economics. Now he’s offering frigging advice to GM? Mind if I say ‘Thanks, but piss off you frigging moron?’

well they can’t go into chapter 7, the shirts on their backs won’t bail them out

Flipper, why don’t YOU go and do it then? Don’t have the money? Not in your state? Oh, then nevermind. But you need to fix it anyway…

I’m rather upset that they gave that money to them. I will buy domestic when they come back in quality. When my friend’s ford ranger’s front right brake caliper snaps and grinds itself into the wheel locking it it up when your miles from home, it’s kinda hard to recommend the vehicle, especially when it had 12,000 miles on it….

The problem lies with the workers in the end. While I don’t want anyone to lose their job, in the end it is their fault for expecting so much out of their very little work. Being over paid to put a door on a car just makes me annoyed. Going in at 18 and retiring at 48 with full benefits? Sorry, GM needs to figure something out, they saw it comin for a long time and the didnt change. So, they fail because no one wants a car from a maker that might chapter 11, and people dont want a car from a maker that has already chapter 11ed. Done either way.

Wow, I actually agree with McCain for once! Maybe he isn’t too old and senile after all. Let GM go down and restructure. It doesn’t mean the end of the world or the company for that matter. I hate having the government snooping around companies thinking they know what they are doing. Let the market sort itself out!

Why is Need more oil for GM still allowed to post? He’s quite possibly the dumbest 10 year old around.

Also, Need more oil for (the failing) GM: GM has a clear mission? Let the other 2 (Ford and Chrysler) die? Funny, last I looked Chrysler was hurting but trying for form partnerships and at least attempting to survive, and Ford has not received any financial aid from the government. Meanwhile GM continues to crumble and…you guessed it….ask for more loans.

You’re so ignorant, stop posting here.

I would just like to say that buying/having an import car does not mean you do not support America.

@ F3INT))AP3X-
Good point. It means quite the opposite actually. Toyota has most its manufacturing plants in the States. If Toyota fell it would be equally as devastating to the economy as would GM falling, if not more so. The American manufacturers have majority of their factories and plants outside to U.S. for the cheaper labor, so it’s just as positive to buy American as it is to buy foreign.

McCain is a classy guy.
And he’s right.
GM can’t afford its current costs, and pretending will just make things worse.

DrFill: “The GOP has no credibillity, no leadership, and no leaders are on the horizon.” No credibility, but Bobby J. and Sarah P. are set up as leaders. Now, the party has to stand for something!

MercMark: “I’d much rather spend MY tax money on manufacturing than a f**king bank or insurance co.” I agree. If we’ve got to prop up businesses, let’s prop up businesses that make or do something.

Need more oil for GM: “Buy American. Buy GM. It is your duty.”

Once again, it is my duty to buy a car I can depend on, to get to work so I can support my family. That’s the ONLY REASON I drive a Buick. If it turns out crappy, I’m done with GM. Of course, i expect this car to be about the same as my previous GM cars.

Spingood Tanoya: I finally figured out your handle!

F3INT))AP3X: “I would just like to say that buying/having an import car does not mean you do not support America.”

You’re right.

I don’t like McCain and Republicans, but on this one he is right.

Infusing taxpayer money on GM won’t save them. They need to go into bankruptcy and re-structure themselves. They need to get out of this mess by themselves, since they are the ones to blame to be on this situation on the first place.
That’s what happens when you create crap cars in the last few decades.

Volt better be no more than $30k if they want to be successful.

No Comment, and it is for a reason he did not win….

JackJimTurkey, took you long enough to figure out Spingood Tanoya. That was funny.

I thought the election was over. Why is McCain still trying to make headlines? As much as I don’t agree with Obama’s policies, he won. It’s over. Spingood Tanoya.

This continuous campaign crap has got to stop. That goes for both sides. Shut up and get back to doing what’s best for the American people, not what’s best for your next election.

Seriously, if Need more oil for GM had some reasoning behind whatever he said, I wouldn’t mind. It is a forum, after all. Unfortunately, nothing he says make sense…I saw a thread where he was calling Toyota the least reliable car company in the world. But I think if we just ignore him, it’ll be fine. Stop commenting on his remarks; we’re just feeding into it…

However, I don’t want to see GM cave in like that. The fall of GM will spell apocalypse for every other significant Dow Jones Industrial company…letting a company fall into bankruptcy isn’t good, especially if it has so many workers and so many links to other countries. You guys really have to look at it in a different perspective.

I’m a little tired of hearing all these claims that Toyota has a huge presence in America without any kind of proof. Where are all these alleged factories? last I checked there were only 5 major Toyota plants(3 of which were, and may still be, on a shut down) in the US and their 2 Toyota N.A. headquarters buildings which accounted for employment of Less than 40,000 employees total in the US. If there’s something I’m missing then please, educate me. But I’m tired of hearing these empty unquantified statements about Toyota’s US presence.

If that 40,000 number is remotely right then I would say that’s a pretty good presence Cardemon04. That’s 40,000 jobs for Americans. How many do you want before you say they have a “presence”?? I’m not saying they are one of the largest, but when they make announcements about their production people take notice. Especially here in Indiana where they have the Princeton plant and dual plant with Subaru in Lafayette.

philjo1978, please don’t forget that before McCain became unsuccessful presidential candidate he was a a war hero. He spend 7 years in Hanoi Hilton defending right of Americans to do what they would like to do and drive what they would like to drive. He drove his Toyota for years, and did not give crap about narrow minded perceptions. The reason: he fought for this country and serve it with valor. Did you?

I’m by no means belitteling those 40k jobs. I was referring to 96sert’s claim that “Toyota has most its manufacturing plants in the States.” Toyota does not have the most plants and employs about 1/3 the number of Americans that GM does. I loathe the people who take a few plants here and there and claim an enormous presence blindly.

Well, maybe all GM needed is 40K workers since they are not selling more vehicles then Toyota? Could it be the reason Toyota is not bordering bankruptcy? Yes, they are having hard times (every company does) but they are not insolvent and cost us taxes.

injuinraiv- I’m sure you’ve offered suggestions in things your not all educated about before, am I right? I’m willing to say it’s common knowledge that we’ve really fvcked up our economy and thrown a LOT of money down the drain… If you agree with McCain, why criticize the man?

cardemon- Although 96sert’s english isn’t up to par, I translated that as them having many plants, not the most plants. Your also forgetting all the parts they outsource from America. So yes, they do have a big prescence, not nearly as big as Gm or Ford, but still large.

Actually, I understood 96sert’s comment to mean that Toyota has more plants inside the U.S. than they do in any other country, i.e. they have 5 here, but only 4 or less in Japan.

fan, one point about your comment that chapter 11 isn’t “the end” but a parachute…you’re right that it is intended to be that, but do realize that circuit city just closed it’s doors for good, and they went through chapter 11 as well…

fact is, chapter 11 can result in the permanent liquidation of a company…there is no guaranteed rebirth of a leaner and meaner company, necessarily…

what i don’t understand is why ford, which has so far successfully avoided the corporate death-spiral, isn’t view by wall street more promisingly…any company that can survive this should have some profit potential when the recovery happens, right?

Ford lost its access to credit about 18 months ago. Wall street does not see it as a contender or survivor because Ford mortgaged everything (patents, properties, trademarks) for 23 billions about 18 months ago. And they are loosing money. GM was in better shape, before credit crunch – they could get some credit. Ford will out of cash and credit sometime before fall of this year. But as long as they can hold to remainder of 23 billions, they look good on paper. Whatever will be provided to GM maybe viewed as a precedent for Ford. But if GM is has to deal with real chapter 11, Ford is not far behind.

I thank we should cut off McCain’s oxygen supply. I am tired of that doddering old buffoon. He can drive his car in a lake as far as I’m concerned. That said, we should not bail out GM only because people like Obama will be in charge of telling GM how to spend the money the taxpayers are providing. The last thing we need is for that dickhead to mandate the types of cars we drive… Hold on… they already do it… I don’t see how automakers are going to make it in this era of overregualtion, unfunded mandates and ever higher CAFE requirements. The age of the motorcar is dead for a while.

McCain can’t decide what he wants to belive in…..therefore he lost the election.

Now we have a president who believes in “spreading the wealth”.

time for him to bring in a ringer, joe the auto company ceo

I 150% agree with Mr. John McCain. The Obama administration is succeeding at helping GM suck. GM isn’t going to change the value and image of their cars. The gigantic corporation is like that poor little rich kid right now that needs help…as far as I’m concerned it SHOULDN’T be from the American people’s pockets.

Toyota has 5 major plants in the U.S., along with 2 more that I believe have been finished or are being worked on currently, then another scheduled to be built in 2010, as well has “joint-owning” 2 additional plants (one with GM, one with Subaru).

Just stating that a Toyota has a significant presence here in the States and has an impact on the economy.

@ jayjc08 – My English is just fine, as is my typing; not sure what you’re getting at. There’s no reason to degrade someone before you attempt to state your own feedback to the topic. Unless it’s Need more oil for GM.

Wow can the GOP get any more desperate!

Firstly, they are simply acting as ridiculous obstructionists.

Secondly, instead of hoping to get out of this mess, mostly exacerbated by themselves in the last 8 years, they elect a interim spokesman that wishes that the current administration FAILS !!! Like WOW, talk about cutting your nose to spite your face. They wish the American people to have 4 years of failure and continuation of a major recession then hope that the economy turns around. I don’t know about you but if I were American I wouldn’t be voting for the DEFEATIST party in my country.

Thirdly, McCain also gets up accompanied with his other GOP “used car salesman” attitudes and starts claiming that they should now let the largest bank in the world, CITI fail. Are you a TOTAL IDIOT. This whole world wide bank bailout all happened after Paulson refused to bail out Lehman Brothers after it already bailed out the much smaller Bear Sterns. That ripple effect is what we’re dealing with now, from Lehman failing/not getting bailed out, and spreading it to all sectors of the credit freeze. Although, giving billions away to rich bankers, who got themselves into their own greedy messes, does not sound to me like the best way … The fact of the matter is that it is the BEST way to get out of this – because if those institutions fail the downturn we are having right now will look like a fairytale to what would be in store.

So to McCain and is stupid GOP wannabe’s … seriously STFU! From a guy in the campaign who was so assured that the economy was fine, wow I should really trust you now and take your ridiculous advice. Ohhhh, although if I was married to a billionaire (his wife) and had 7 homes I guess money to me would really be no object – they probably have it stuffed away in those UBS accounts the Obama administration is trying to track down and tax.

Screw the GOP and long live the Obama administration!

e46Ne90:
so you prefer the option of buying a car from a manufacturer whos on a gimp and living off social welfare (as long as theres still money left in the pots for this waste of dough), from buying a car from a manufacturer that FINALLY acts responsibly?

anyway, as of today, most people would rather have their ears pierced to their buttocks than drive a gm vehicle…

Better to let a cancer like GM dies and unburden the average americans. Of course if they’re being patriotic they can certainly spend their tax dollars on GM and let it sink into a never ending blackhole. Though personally I don’t see anything democratic and patriotic by feeding selfish executives and lazy union workers. Your choice though…. glad I left US.

@ Omnicient

Hey, easy! Your side won. I thought you were supposed to be happy. Also according the the previous eight years a president cannot blame the previous administration for any national ills. Right?

Lets start off like this. I despise McCain. There I said it. I hate the way he speaks. I’m furious about many of the things that he has done and is doing as a senator. However, doesn’t it strike you as odd that he is echoing many of the sentiments of many who want to see GM survive and prosper?

If it were completely up to me, I’d let GM sink into memory. If a company doesn’t make money on a continued basis it needs to make changes to affect that for the positive. GM consistently chose not to do this.

i like McCain fries.

C’mon Johnny, retire already and shut your big mouth. Nobody cares about what you have to say anymore.

Snuggle up to that creepy wife of yours, pop a via gra and forget about what’s going on in the world ’cause the world’s forgotten about you.

Veda, not all of us chose this way. I certainly didn’t.

I’m with ZCarSales – I didn’t like McCain, either. In fact, I don’t think I’m happy with any politician right now. Is there something in the Potomac that’s infecting these people?

Fledgling? How is the US auto industry “fledgling”? Epic word FAIL! I think “floundering” is the word…

Sore loser.

McCain is an irrelevant old fool who needs to spend his days playing bridge and shuffleboard.

His job is not at stake if GM fails, so why should he care?

Typical Herbert Hoover Repuglican.

Circumstances under which GM and Chrysler find themselves are precisely why Chapter 11 re-organization exists.

United and Delta sought Chapter 11 bankruptcy relief from creditors and it didn’t stop passengers from buying airline tickets.

K-Mart went into bankruptcy after which it merged with Sears Roebuck.

Conseco Insurance didn’t stop selling insurance because it filed for bankruptcy. — Athens

The problem with those other companies are that they don’t provide warranty for 4 years after your buy the car. Having a manufacturer’s warranty is one of the reason why many buy new rather than pre-owned.

Perhaps Conseco Insurance is the closest analogy, but it is still very different from GM’s situation. The fact is that you can take your insurance business elsewhere easy enough, comparing that to trying to sell a 3000lbs paper weight with a “bankrupt” brand when you are upside down on your car loan. It’s a matter of perception.

Don’t forget, your car purchase is the second most expensive purchase after your home. Then you can appreciate the concern why GM may not be able to afford a bankruptcy, whether reorganization or liquidation.

Bottom line…. McCain is right and GM should go into chapter 11 and break the union once and for all. Unions were needed in the day but in today’s world they are not needed. Then slim line the products and just narrow down to 3 or 4 divisions Cadillac, Chevrolet, GMC, Pontiac. Dump all of the other stuff like Saturn, Hummer, Pontiac, and so forth. GM could come out on top using that approach.