GM. AN American Revolution

As for the amount of oil, I don’t even think our children will have issues. I myself am not a geologist, but I grew up with one, work for many, and even my father-in-law is a geophysicist. I know no one would care for details, but the way businesses work is that they are only willing to scale with what is needed at the time plus 6 months. We have tankers that sit offshore that are loaded, just waiting for when the price is right to sell. And they will sit out there for months, even making an artificial shortage if they have to just to sell. If you are looking at the supply as to what we are drilling right now, then you have to look 6 months ahead to see the reaction to the demand(how long it takes to increase production, really). If you look at supply as to how large the reservoirs are…then I can’t help you. Shell doesn’t want BP to see its cards. Chevron doesn’t want Marathon to see its cards. Thats the reason why everyone thinks we’re going to run out, but its just because they are guessing how much we have made compared to how much we are developing.

Now this is just my scope of things since I don’t work for anyone as big as Core Lab or Weatherford (not that many here know who they are anyway), but Nigeria was the talk of the town in the 90s, and now it looks like Angola. But that doesn’t mean Nigeria stopped. It just stopped developing. The wells there are still producing. And its not just offshore stuff. We keep drilling into new reservoirs in places like Kazakhstan. Even Oklahoma is still building wells into fields that still have life in them. Again, not saying I know everything, but everything I do know says we’re fine economically. Its the politicians I worry about, hehe.

Demand will drop off of in countries like China where the population is getting ready to make a sharp decline in the next two generations. Japan will be even worse, but then their demand is nowhere near as high.

As a side note, we have plenty invested in wind. They’ve ruined my uncle’s “sky as far as you can see” horizon. Hydro electric we need to be careful with since it can effect coastal and river ecologies. I now wish I wrote down the show, but there was a state(east coast, I think) that tried installing three HE generators, and they became more trouble than help. One was always inoperable and then discovered that they were sucking in fish, either killing or injuring them. This was just a small scale experiment to see if it would be okay to implement dozens, and it was decided that they couldn’t continue. Solar would be a great idea for small areas(already used on many houses to save on a/c costs). On a large scale, you would need a huge amount of real estate. Even sending up solar satellites would be impractical on a large scale because of how much would be lost in the atmosphere. And for small scale it is too expensive to implement. Cars are simply not large enough to put enough panels on them for highway driving. This was a pretty big side note….

In an ideal world the energy required for hydrogen production would come from other renewable energy sources i.e solar hydro-electric, wind. But again those areas aren’t being invested in nearly as much as they should be.

What is needed is a fuel source thats value is close to or greater than that of fossil fuels. Ethanol isn’t the answer when it takes almost twice the amount to get the same amount of energy from fossil fuels.

Also its not entirely about running out of fossil fuels, we need a fuel source that doesn’t pollute our environment as much as fossil fuels

Keep it at petroleum. There is a reason it is used, like he said. Using corn throws the prices of all its products way up. It hurts the average man who then can’t afford the expensive ethanol. Then prices have to go up for that to counteract the lack of sale. Then include lower mpg and less is sold. Etc.

I really don’t see how producing ethanol will do anything beside make more work for farms. Having to clear those wild, natural fields to plant it with their diesel powered tractors….then harvest it with more diesel power. I don’t quite understand why people can’t accept the fact it takes energy to make energy. Hydrogen is no different. In order to get all that hydrogen, it does take power. And where does most of that power come from? Coal. Natural gas. Nuclear power. Unless you actually pay for the more expensive renewable energy.

The reason we have an oil infrastructure is because it is energy that is readily available. The only thing that costs oil companies is exploration. And wouldn’t you know, we keep finding more. Its not as finite as people believe it to be.

As for countries not being friendly with us…I can’t believe you think everyone in the UAE or Saudi or Angola is a terrorist. They may get contributions from corrupt officials, but they don’t control the oil. Governments control the oil! And I can easily say that must make “Big Oil” some of the most charismatic folks to talk governments into selling their resources to the world. And irc, we don’t have many contracts with Iraq. Before the last war, most of them were with Total (French). They probably resumed those contracts after the Iraqi parliament was established, but I don’t follow that news. If it still worries you that your funding terrorism for some reason, just buy Conoco (not that is matters much, all oil ends up in the same refinery pretty much).

Even when we exhaust oil in the possible centuries it would take, the lack of gas or diesel would be the last of your worries. It will be global anarchy. Then another stone age when the fighting is over. Or bronze age if things are favorable.

For ethanol, I feel sorry for the scientists that have been ridiculed for siding against the environmentalists on this one. Everything else has already been said one way or another.

Sending money to farmers is much better than sending money to muslim terrorists that want to kiil you. You’re almost contradicting yourself.

Plus its been raining for a couple of days where I am, if there was an easy and affordable way of converting water into liquid hydrogen people could just collect rain water, convert it to hydrogen and fuel there automobile. Two major problems with this scenario right now though. The Government is to easily influenced by outside sources (oil companies etc) that they will not seek other means for fuel. As well liquid hydrogen is a little more volatile than petrol so theres that risk. But BMW has been producing 7 series over in Europe that can run on both conventional fuel and liquid hydrogen. It is possible for the automotive industry to stop relying on petrol based fuel but why would they? If anyone has seen the documentary “who killed the electric car?” will know that automotive manufactures do not want to stop using petrol. GM scrapped there EV project to go with the gas guzzling Hummer H2. Auto Manufacturers do not care about alternative fuel/Hybrid/Electric vehicles as they lead us to believe.

The truth is that Corn-Gas is widely accepted in 3rd world country’s. And that if they with their limited resources can adapt to greener means… Why not the U.S., well we all know the answer to that question BIG OIL, money talks and everyone has something to say… One thing for sure is that the U.S. Military is the Largest, THE LARGEST consumer of Petrol-Fuel in the WORLD…

Unless Federal and Local Governments make the switch them self to Cleaner Burning Fuel, it’s all B.S.

With the vasts selection of vehicles on the market and the developing of Cleaner-Fuel rising. Corn-Fuel, Bio-Diesel, alternate mixtures of Jet-Fuel, it’s very possible that in the next 2 years a switch can be made. It should not be a hard to do…

But like I said, one’s opinion is only a extension of one’s vasts knowledge of their world…

You want to use more ethanol… here’s what will happen.

Gas companies start buying corn from farmers to turn into fuel… which means the price of anything that uses corn directly or indirectly is going to go up. Corn meal, corn syrup, corn oil, corn fed beef and chicken, milk and eggs, any product that is made with milk and eggs… you see where this is going?

We have technology today that could make cars run off of water… but we are smart enough to know better. There is only so much water to go around… and I pay $1.50 for a 20oz bottle of it all ready, what happens when people start pumping millions of gallons of it into their cars.

There was a logical reason that gasoline was chosen as a motor fuel 100 years ago. It has a high energy potential, is (relatively) abundant, and isn’t really useful for any other purpose.

The only reason that people are pushing so hard to get off of petroleum products is because the vast majority of petroleum is controlled by countries who aren’t exactly friendly towards the US or its allies. Thus we see the foolishness of having your economy and livelihood completely dependent on sources and factors outside of your own control.

And while we make it here the oil still comes mostly from overseas.

Not sure how the “US industry” not having good diesels here has anything to do with all the other marques not bringing over their diesels. IT IS THE COST that keeps all of them from selling here.

i think the EPA bashing here is myopic, though…as much as you want to believe any green-minded agency is out to destroy your life, you missed the point of the article…congress is mandating more ethanol usage, and congress is under the sway of the corn industry…this is a lobbyist driven movement…the EPA, in this case, is just the messenger…the real head vampires are the guys paid by the corn industry (lobbyists) to get legislation pushed through congress…

FORD – we dont need Goverment Money

Everybody involved in ethanol research agrees that corn-based ethanol is basically the bastard child of bad and expensive farming subsidies and early technological innovation. Until we have another way that’s energy efficient to produce ethanol, like switch grass, hemp or sugar cane (look at Brazil, they’re doing it right), then nothing should be done to our gas.

Plus it limits the performances of our cars and reduces our gas-mileage, so please tell me where the pro lays…

I bet Sta-Bil is voting for E15.

“Now all of the above counties are rich and we are a 3rd world country.”

Pampanga has always been part of a 3rd world country…and all of the above countries were always rich, ever since.

GM is a leader in E-85 capable vehicles. I am completely for this because all the imports who don’t have E-85 capable vehicles will be up sh1ts creek. It will speel the end for imports, excluding diesels. The guys around here are wearing their “30″ buttons, maybe they chould be wearing “60″ buttons instead if this passes!

GM. AN American Revolution

WE need to get rid of oil usage from overseas asap. Obviously electrics are both too expensive and do not have the range needed. Hybrids are a step in the right direction but still too expensive for prime time. The extended range is the next step but again too expensive for prime time. Diesel is a possibility but AGAIN too expensive for prime time with the onerous emission requirements.

We as Americans with gas under $3 refuse to drive less or buy smaller cars. So what else is left?

Ethonal is the only short term solution. And it will not be coming from corn in the mid term. A much better solution is to use our garbage and junk to make it. It is actually cheaper than making it from corn and is already proven. Just need to have a market for it and forcing E15 or E20 would do it.

“patented bacteria is able to turn most forms of garbage into ethanol at cost of about $1 per gallon — less than half the current cost. The still-experimental fermentation process is capable of turning feedstocks such as municipal wastes, old tires, wood chips and even corn stalks into ethanol fuel”

http://autos.canada.com/autoshow2008/story.html?id=65a17afb-f4fc-44ac-99bc-fdd4ecb98292

BUT with all that we cannot just raise to E15 until it is tested and most likely it will take years to change over all the motors (including mowers, etc). So the only solution is to offer both E10 and E20 at the pumps with the SAME price (MPG weighted). How we charge the same price is up to someone else.

@mtzo
Oil is fungible – anything we manage to not use just makes it cheaper for others and supply and demand means there will be an offsetting increase in consumption somewhere else. At best a neutral outcome. Emulating Europe is not desirable – if the US grows at 2.5% and the EU grows at 2% for 100 years – our economy will be more than 50% bigger than the EU. Currently the US GDP is 9.5% less than the EU.

Politicians are whores with a next election time horizon.

“Do the new CAFE standards mean we will be buying smaller cars?”
“No, it just means that our elected officials are a bunch of whores.”

“Does the Medicare problem mean the destruction of our country?”
“No, it just means that our elected officials are a bunch of whores.”

“How’s that peanut butter sandwich?”
“Our elected officials are a bunch of whores.”

See if you can come up with your own questions for that answer. It’s a great answer to almost any question.

“What is the meaning of life?”
“Our elected officials are a bunch of whores.”

Ah, the wisdom.