did they also approve subsidized funding?

damn, government, way to screw your domestic automakers. gm needs those rear drive cars to successfully turn their cash issue around.

Yeah right, like you can get 30% better fuel mileage simply by scrapping all RWD vehicles and switching to a FWD design. Come on GM, that’s pathetic. RWD vehicles are just fine, but it’s about time ALL vehicles reach a higher MPG than they currently do. GM should innovate even further (like forcing carbon fiber to become cheaper to mass-produce etc.) and they’ll achieve that 30% better fuel efficiency.

I was watching Autoline Detroit (www.autolinedetroit.tv). Guest of the show was Bob Lutz. He said CAFE standards didn’t work for the past thirty years, so why would it work now? And, if that bill gets approved and will force to produce cars with complience to emissions, manufacturers will be forced to make cars so expencive, that noone will buy ‘em.

if its not gonna work with big rear wheel drive cars and such, then perfect. America will be like the next Europe with all small hatchbacks with diesel engines!!!

8 bucks/gallon probably will happen in 2020.

With a 35 mpg standard, we will be driving Honda Civics, Toyota Prius, and Kia Rios. Way to go, American public. Thank you for sticking us with the Democrats. The Republicans were terrible, but this is way worse. I think that Congresspeople ought to drive the cars they are trying to force us to drive.

Its my money, let me drive what I want. I don’t like SUVs, but I don’t like a Prius either. Moron jackasses….I guess I’ll find somehting fun to drive before that runs out.

Only 35!??

i got a feeling this isnt going to help anyone, they wont make the goal, especially with no government funding.

The standard proposed isn’t too bad, although it’s going to kill some of the performance car market. I can’t begin to imagine how Mazda’s rotaries will survive into a 35mpg standard, let alone 50mpg. And for the folks who dearly love those engines, that’s going to be a shame.

GM can achieve these targets with RWD and AWD cars. They’d better. I could give two woodpeckers about their FWD cars.

All in all, with pure electrics and hydrogen internal combustion engines far away from real world usability and AFFORDABLE sales, it doesn’t make me very happy about buying new cars.

High engine power burns more gas, thus achieving a lower mpg rating.

Currently, the biggest issue facing hotrodders is passing a performance modified engine through tough emissions checks. What would really, really, REALLY bother many enthusiasts are regulations that state you cannot modify a car’s engine in such a way as to lower the effectiveness of it’s original fuel economy rating. And what if they made such a rule retroactive to a certain model year?

THAT would really irk me way beyond new fuel economy standards. If that happened, I think I’d consider the entire “sport compact” car market a complete joke from then on.

Let’s hope this is the worst next to high gas and diesel prices.

I’d really like to know more about hydrogen internal combustion and the potential of those engines in hotrods.

global_Lightning, I agree with you for the most part, but certain standards do bother me:

Drive-By-Wire Throttle – I don’t like the idea that in the future, it’ll be easy to modify these systems with a little device that will cut my engine’s acceleration by a police officer for whatever reason warranted or not.

Emissions – Where I will be moving in a year (California) I think they have the most insipid stance on emissions control in passenger vehicles in the entire United States. Why? Because after deciding that there isn’t currently a newer car I’m interested in and that I’d like to swap an engine of my choice into a used car that I AM interested in, I’ve hit a roadblock. In California, it doesn’t matter if you pass the tailpipe emissions as required for your year vehicle or even produce less emissions as the result of an engine swap. They want the same model year engine or newer and they won’t allow any modification to exhaust manifolds before the catalytic convertors. If the engine has fitment issues (ie: the exhause manifolds hit the steering column of your swap car) and it requires you to build custom fit manifolds, your car is considered unpassable. It still passes emissions as required for the engine, you say? That’s great, but it still fails and cannot be registered for road use.

Government mandated stability control for every vehicle – That’s really great, I guess. Great, as long as I have a convenient little button to turn the system off COMPLETELY. If I am driving at the track or on a real racetrack with my car, I don’t want the car’s system getting in the way of my driver input. Some, very few performance cars have an aggressive and race-oriented version of stability control that actually works with the driver to achieve a faster lap time… but you pay very good money for cars like that. Most cars are not built in this way even if they are “sporty”. I prefer an “off” switch should I so desire and I’d also prefer my insurance company not to penalize me in the event of an accident if I prefer to leave stability control off most of the time during normal driving just because driver-nanny systems are deemed easier to implement than more intensive driving training courses. I don’t like nannies. ABS for the road is a valued exception.

If anything, I’d like to see a tougher set of standards for driver training mandated by state governments. Tougher doesn’t have to mean “hard with no reward”. How about teaching how to drive manual transmissions, driving on a highway, proper passing technique, learning the limits of a car’s handling characteristics in a safe and controlled environment with an instructor and teaching one of the most important aspects of driving safely: always look at the horizon and not at just what’s directly in front of you. This would teach license candidates to observe multiple road factors up ahead and make decisions based on more than just going straight and leaving enough distance.

I agree with better driver training. I also think the government should take environmental factors into account other than MPG, IE the amount of pollution it takes to make batteries used in hybrids.

I believe that the gasoline V6 engine will die out because of this. All bottom feeder base model cars will come with regular and turbo 4 bangers to maximize CAFE ratings and any V6’s left will be diesel. The V8 muscle, luxury, and SUV’s will remain because that is what people have always and truly desired no matter what the political and economic climate and the V10, V12 and V16 super and hyper cars will survive because the owners probably are on the boards of oil companies and Ferrari and Lambo etc will just pay the fines as they do now. This is no big deal.

pathetic gm… i thought they were THAT close to building their first hybrid, or even totally eCar? They shouldnt be bothered by the emission regulations, taking into account that this will not be put into use until 13 years from now?

pathetic gm….

I wonder what kinda cars the people that approve these measures actually drive. It’d be interesting to find out.

Diesel, Fuel Cell and Hybrid technology; Get used to it. It’s the future.

35mpg is not something that will increase the price of cars that significantly. By 2020, gas will probably be around 10 bucks a gallon, meaning that fewer people will afford to drive anyways. Less cars on the road, less traffic, less dumb drivers, less pollution, more cargo being transported by electric trains instead of trucks, more people riding bikes and walking ( less fat people)… am I the only one that sees this as a GOOD thing? And seriously, we have cars that easily reach 35mpg now, by 2020 we should have cars that pull 100mpg. All we need is for hybrids not to look like a joke from the Jetsons and we’re in business.

Typical Democrat math, throwing numbers out there and hoping they stick without actually doing any research. 50mpg by 2030?? Sure, sounds good and all environmentally fuzzy! Who cares if its actually possible?

Jesus Christ! WAKE UP!
This isn’t about GM, Ford, or any automaker domestic or foreign. It’s about society. You can chastise GM all you want, because it’s so fun, but your hostilities are completely misdirected. Automakers have the ability to manufacture these vehicles, but what is the sense if nobody will to buy them?? And it’s not about design or interior or any other **** that constantly gets vomited around here. 50mpg vehicles will need to be very small, enjoy. Judging by the reactions from many of you when these types of cars are posted on here, NOBODY wants them. Sure, it might be a cute little alternative, but that very affordable 350Z is so much more fun! Everyone wants a roomy, powerful car or truck. So GM starts building these econo mouse traps and the hypocrites of this country including the ones who wrote this legislation, and the king of them all Al Gore, will still be buying what they themselves refer to as “gas guzzling toxin spewers” that other manufacturers intelligently still produce. But like good little citizens, you’ll be buying the mousetraps because that’s what the general public will afford since the big vehicles will be taxed to hell.

Like sheep, cheer leaders roar with approval when junk like this gets passed by legislators. Everyone should be asking for more solutions, better solutions. Instead, we get a bunch of libs in the Senate saying “we don’t care how you do it, just do it!”. Someone mentioned ’subsidized’ something. So not only are they raping auto manufacturers and not providing solutions as usual, but now they are wasting your tax dollars AGAIN.

For those who think this is about global warming, check this article out. It’s a real perspective on what will happen if the earth indeed heats up… http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,481684,00.html

For those who think this is about energy independence, do you have any idea what percentage of crude oil gets converted to gasoline in the US?? Any idea? It’s 18%. 18% of crude is refined for gasoline. If you want to make an impact on the consumption of oil, use less plastic, which accounts for 65%. Drive gas mileage through the roof all you want, does nothing for that 65% that is still being refined for plastic.

Ask for real solutions. Not this BS.

FC…lol, do some research on those and find out just how environmentally UN-friendly they are.

Wait a second, how many miles per gallon does plastic get? Can we make hybrid plastic forks? I use those reusable shopping bags for groceries, am I a hippy and don’t even know it?

I think a home with backup solar power and a battery system is cool… not that I can afford that kind of investment right now.

As for “green” cars, I’ll buy a “green” car that has a drivetrain pointing in the correct direction like a proper car and not like the Honda Insight or Toyota Prius. I’m quite content to own a few “gas guzzling toxin spewers” for some time to come. I’m not opposed to efficient city cars, however (like the upcoming VW Bug that is a rear engined 3-cylinder). I just also want my RX-7 in the garage next to it.

There are a lot of green technologies I’m interested in. Unfortunately, all of them are unavailable and extremely unaffordable for public consumption right now. In the interim, Piablo has it right (although there will still be some V6 gas engines ;> ) in that the truly expensive luxury and supercars will continue to be built no matter what era and economic future we will be living in. It’s the choices for the everyman that will be limited and taxed severely.

dunno why people must make things a “my country is better than yours” issue all the time.

They should just force everyone to use the Yokohama E-Spec tires that are lighter because it uses citrus oil instead of petrol. Even better try applying the same technology to the interior of the car as well, making the car truly “green” while realistically reducing gas consumption as well. Could be a possibility…

Would ‘global cooling’ be a bad thing? what if the greenies succeeded in correcting the ‘global warming’ issue? Hmmm, I suspect that the enviromentalist brown shirts will be changing their slogans to include all different types of climate movement just to cover their fund raising events year round.
I am for improved emissions and fuel economy, but I think this type of feel good legislation has auto makers spending lots of time and $ looking for loop holes.
The day is coming when my V-Strom will be considered enviromentally unfriendly at 60+mpg.
What kind of mileage does your bike get Piablo?

35 MPG by 2020?? thats pathetic shows you far behind the USA is, they seriously need to catch up.

“If anything, I’d like to see a tougher set of standards for driver training mandated by state governments.” – Comment by Hyperion, posted on May9 at 9:46 pm
.
This part of your post is singing to the choir as far as I’m concerned. I’ve been advocating stuff like this to friends and family for years. Actual driver education with real and measurable standards, taken seriously by both instructors and students, would solve 90% of the problems on the road. As for the nanny state, that’s easy. All people have to do is apply the core lesson from our ideal driver’s education course: Individual Personal Responsibility. This can’t be done because it makes entirely too much sense, so never mind. Move along, nothing to see here.

Homeboy, that’s a bit rich coming from you. How often do you sing the praises of BMW’s M cars that get 10mpg?

Talk about good timing. Looks like this goal won’t be hard to reach after alll… http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/05/070510093248.htm

My saturn gets 40 mpg

When will energy efficiency become patriotic? Seems like it was in World War II. Is now any different? It’s almost like it’s cool and American to waste energy. We’re smarter than that people. What’s the problem in asking…no, DEMANDING that automakers step up their game and provide efficient cars and trucks that get the job done and are still fun to drive? Is that asking too much?

I can tell you right now, I’m driving a Buick Lacrosse rental, and though it’s nice and well-appointed, I don’t need all this power to drive 5 miles to work in traffic. And yes, I do have to drive it, else I’d be on the Metro. You tap on the gas and the thing jets forward. Come on now, we’ve gotta stop acting like little children with our toys.

Fatstrat – Funny you should mention, my Vegas gets about 33mpg. So I guess in a few years I will be riding a 2 wheeled gas guzzler! I am curious if CAFE standards apply to motorcycles. If so, well Victory and Harley Davidson will have a pretty difficult time.

Feel good legislation is what keeps the #$%^@ politicians in office. The uneducated love feel good politics. Judging by the reactions here, some get it, some don’t. Some don’t want to get it. There are days I wish I didn’t either, ignorance sure is bliss.

suthuna – I couldn’t agree with you more. What I sometimes disagree on is the way we do so. Legislation like this isn’t always the answer. It doesn’t address any particular problem. Someone on here or another article correctly likened it to applying a bandaid to a bullet wound. Why is energy being wasted? Start addressing that question and we can start solving the problem. Why are cars so inefficient? One guess has to do with current legislation mandating current design. As you already pointed out, people want the world, big luxury cars with big power yet low mileage. Crumple zones, traction control, tire pressure sensors, the list goes on. We wouldn’t need half of it if manufacturers were able to build lighter vehicles. It’s really a paradox. Go up to the article about the new Supra coming out and read the reactions to it. People want their power and performance, period. Mandating legislation like this causes more problems than it solves and still does not address the problems causing our current situation.

The way America should work, is that the market should decide the direction manufacturers head. Governmental over-legislation is the real tragedy. Now don’t take me out of context and claim that I think the government has no place in this issue (or others), but in terms of how they are dealing with it now, I think is wrong headed.
Thinking people know, that Global warming as presented by the mainstream enviromental movement/algore is as legitimate as sea monkeys and sasquatch. Gulfstream liberals are shallow, stupid, and hypocrites of the highest order.

Hey Piablo, Victory Rocks!
I just replaced my dear departed 750VDC…RIP
with the Suzuki V-strom with ABS. Sweet bike.

And you also wouldnt come close to providing the power reqirements of your home.
The average home does not have enough square feet of roof area to install enough pv cells to provide anywhere near what it uses. I also doubt the power companies are going to pay ‘half’ of what a practical system would cost.
Not intended to flame, just the facts.

Once again, Washington proves that it knows nothing about cars.

All Congress has to do is repeal the law of diminishing returns.

To all geniuses that predict that gas will go up drastically get your fact right! Douche bags.

The reasons Europeans pay more in fuel costs is due to taxes for roads and other needs of the citizens of the countries that do such. Unlike US where most MONEY go to the OIL THUGS.

Unless this country start a National Healthcare Program or some program to get Americans off our Oil Habit. Or even better yet The OIL THUGS get Americans to believe they will find more OIL in some yet unknown threat that has to be liberated and we tax payers must front the liberation costs. AT THAT TIME WE WILL WE BE PAYING $8 – 15 A GALLON.:-(

WISE-UP

uh, was that really a ‘war for oil’ comment.
dang, i thought all the dinosaurs were extinct.

LOL! Not sure, there was even a sentence fragment regarding socialized medicine too. Socialized medicine program to help wein us off oil? I suppose I have heard worse ideas like John Travolta’s proposal to build cities in bubbles from now on to reduce global warming.

In terms of why oil is expensive at the moment, it is due in large part to the weak dollar value. Oil is traded on a global market. The Euro is roughly twice the value of the dollar, making oil more expensive for us to buy. Their willingness to pay a certain price with a higher valued currency drives up the price. When the dollar rebounds, oil will become less expensive.

Not to mention local/state taxes. At least where I live its an extortionary amount.