subsidies

Anyone take a look at the prices in the U.S.? Mark up of over $6000.00!!!! at a local dealership. Even without mark up the they wanted $28,000.00!! for a Prius!! Compare that with a brand new Insight from Honda at $22,000.00. And that wasn’t a loaded one, One that had more features they wanted get this, $38,000.00!!!!! And this one still didn’t come with the solar roof panel for the air conditioning!!!

Toyota better give there dealers a reality check, and knock some sense into them and stop the ridiculous price markups!! Don’t they realize that cars aren’t selling these days, and marking up the price is just going to make that worse!!!

There’s no way they can justify those prices. I thought Toyota was going to lower the price on the new Prius? They seem to have changed there mind. I find that disturbing in our economy and the fact that Toyota LOST MONEY last quarter. This isn’t going to help them not one bit.

horvatic, Insight is $20K without dealer prep and destination charges. Dealers are dealers, they all try to screw you, from your point of view, and make a living from theirs. Ask Dr.Fill for a good price.
BTW, for ****s and giggles I test drove Insight yesterday. It handles much more as a car compare to old Prius. Weight in the tail was almost undistinguished. Actually wasn’t bad, if slush box is your thing.

Is the build quality on these things any good? I’ve driven one for a couple of days, and was kept amused with how the car worked and drove (just because its a bit different) but I didn’t really pay attention to the build quality. (I did see much cheap plastic in the interior)…

Do you think the build quality will be compromised because they have upped production?

Speaking of sh*ts and giggles, read C&D’s comparison test of the Prius, Insight and a ‘98 Geo Metro. Granted the writer’s there tend to lean to the enthusiast side much as we do here but after their evaluation I think I’d prefer shooting the rapids on a bloated corpse than be forced to commute in Toyota’s electric coffin.

There’s also another interesting chart outlining the real world differences between normally aspirated and forced induction cars in the same class. I wasn’t really surprised having owned a turbo PT at one point but some of you may be left scratching your heads as to why all the recent push towards turbos.

And did I mention they picked the Mustang over the Camaro and Challenger? Well, you knew I would.

the metro got 43 mpg. the same as the prius
only minus all the eco snobbery that comes with a prius and the insight

excuse me 42 mpg

JC> I might take the Metro over the other 2, atleast it has an E-brake and a stick.
The only really efficient Turbo motors (relative to their output) seem to be GMs Ecotec 2.0, BMWs new TT I-6, the new 1.2 to 1.8L from PSA and Porsches 3.6 variable T. DI seems to help greatly in efficiency of Turbo motors. But the VW 2.0T is a hog as is the new V8 “inverted head” BMW Turbo.
They have picked the Mustang in every comparo vs Camaro since ‘84. This is the 1st time I have disagreed with them.

shaver, Peugot are powered by FIAT. I kid you not. 1.4L and 1.2L gasoline and 1.3, 1.4L diesel engines are sourced from FIAT (actually assembled by FIAT). New (as in BMW MIni) 1.6L is PSA.

Johnny, I had 1987 Civic 4 doors as a commuter and young family car. I never had mileage below 35 mpg (during winter) during spring-fall mileage was in 40’s. The next gen Civic was fuel injected and one of my colleagues bough CIvic hatch with 5 speed. That was a sweet ride, and this kid was getting 40 mpg, without mastery of clutch. We were younger (you and I, most of other bloggers were in diapers) and we were lighter as well as cars. Now we got a few under the belt (or over the belt depends on your belt position) and cars got bigger and heavier. Insight was larger then the second generation Accord and heavier. I do tend to believe that if you drop all that electric wizardry and batteries and hook a 5 speed to the same car it will not sacrifice performance and fuel efficiency (the crash test has to be passed by either electric or purely gasoline version) but will gain entertainment value. It is got to be 300 lbs of batteries, motors and slush transmission weight in hybrid.

I read the C&D review of the Prius, Insight, Geo metro and was thinking how subjective a vehicle’s ride quality and handling are. I’m sure the Prius can’t be much worse than driving heavy ass front drive American sedans (like the myriad Gran Ams, Bonnevilles, Taurus, etc which are total wallowy pieces of crap around corners.) The eco-boxes aren’t supposed to handle, so it shouldn’t be a surprise that they don’t that well.

Borat, not surprisingly I went the domestic route as opposed to your Civic of the same era and spent several years enjoying a plain jane ‘86 two door Reliant 2.2 5 spd (I only took my ‘85 5.0 Capri out on select occasions). Same deal though, the mileage was in the 40’s (Canadian gallon) and it even came with a real back seat and trunk. Like you say however, the same cars today would probably be 500lbs heavier before our increased girth was even factored into the equation.

i haven’t read the c/d review, but i will when i get home…of course i’d much rather drive a new prius than an old metro, even if the mileage is similar…just based on safety alone that’s a no brainer…i’m curious if c/d addressed the emissions angle, which is probably in favor of the prius, too…

i also noticed they picked the mustang over the camaro (the challenger wasn’t really in the running)…honestly that choice really comes down to style vs performance…an age-old quandary…the mustang looks good, but it’s not shiny new…the camaro is shiny omg new, and also performs well, but perhaps isn’t as nimble as the ’stang…half a dozen of one, six of the other, practically…