OK kids, save your pennies. Investment of new millennium is coming up. Watch out Google.

Laughable. GM is worthless, and even more so as an IPO offering.

Old news.

Funny, GM is worthless yet they finished the 3rd quarter with $43 billion in cash and a very strong quarter. Their bonds are now a “buy”. They still have to finish restructuring so that cash will go down but they are going to be left with about $30 billion in cash at the end of the year/restructuring.

GM took in $3.3 billion more in cash than it spent in the third quarter. Meaning if not for the restructuring charges they would have made a profit.

Carstuff – Just curious as you seem to know about the numbers GM had for third quarter. Did GM also put into Delphi to bring them out of Bankruptcy so they could prevent parts shortages? If they did, that also could be part of the reason why they were not making a profit for third quarter.

They have 43 billion in cash, so they are doing well financially. Dude we gave them 50 Billion since December. There is also depriciation. Anyway finacially strong companies post profits, even in this economy. Meaning the value of thier assets, and cash exceeds it’s value from the previous quarter. They are doing less bad, but they were doing horrible before.

GM is very much into “creative finances” for each situation given. By the time the dust has settled GM will be out of business.

carstuff, how one can possibly know what on GM books? As a private company they don’t have to disclose to anyone. Furthermore, there are 2 GM’s under the Sun today. Old and New. Old has 33 billions of liabilities and none of plants, products real estate. And a “new” has 17 billions in liabilities an d owns all of former GM used to own. Which one you find having so much cash on hand? And if you believe it is true, more power to you in fourth quarter of 2010 when you’ll be buying that valuable stock.

Where is NMOFGM when there is a need for explanation of P&L statement?

Yes they did both buy Delphi plants to keep their own plants running and gave them money to fund Delphi pensions.

They have given/paid Delphi $4.1 billion over the first 9 months of the year.

In the last quarter they paid $652 million and still have something like $3 billion more thru the rest of this year.

Part of the deal for GM to get the US funding was to payoff Delphi so that the US pension fund would not be tapped. Remember GM has not owned Delphi for many years.

When GM came out of bankruptcy the DIP money was given to complete restructuring. The plan is to have it completed by the end of 2009.

Gotta tell you, trying to make sense of what is going on is almost impossible. Money is going everywhere and is also coming in (VEBA related). Bottom line is GM brought in more money selling cars than they spent on the true basic part of developing/building them. That is why their bonds have been recommended as a “buy” ( and the fact they have a lot more cash today than they were supposed to).

Ashes to Ashes_Dust to Dust – To hope that a company goes out of business is just a horrible thing to say. How would you feel if the company you worked for was in the same situation. Would you rather have yourself and all your co-workers be unemployed or have assistance for your company to be restructured so massive unemployment doesn’t occur. I don’t really care if you don’t like GM as a company or how it has been run in the past or if you are pissed off because of the CAW/UAW. That doesn’t mean you should disrespectful.

Borat, I am a bit confused by your statement. GM just posted their financials and the data is there. If you think that GM is putting up false data then that can be your opinion but if they ever got caught there would be people hanging by their ….. from the rafters. I surely would not mess with Obama after giving GM the money.

The new company is the one with the assets. I will admit I do not know exactly what the hell this all means below but the bottom line is the new GM has lots of cash.

Preliminary Non-GAAP Managerial Results
“ GM
July 10-Sept. 30, 2009
($mils)
Net revenue $26,352

Earnings before interest and taxes
(before special items) $(261)

Net interest $(250)

Special items $(505)

Earnings before taxes $(1,016)

Taxes $(135)

Total managerial income/(loss) $(1,151)

Managerial operating cash flow
(before special items)($bils) $3.3

Global cash and cash-related balance ($bils) $42.6

more on the cash and where it is going:

As of September 30, 2009, cash and marketable securities totaled $42.6 billion. Included in this amount was $17.4 billion held in escrowed funds from the United States Treasury (UST) and Export Development Canada (EDC), with $8.1 billion of this amount allocable for future repayments of the UST and EDC loans, $2.8 billion for the recently completed Delphi settlement and $900 million for healthcare in Canada, leaving a remaining escrow cash balance of $5.6 billion.

If you rearrange the letters in GM IPO you get MO PIG. Motown Pig… get it? Vanity plate perhaps for the not so vain?

I know… shut up johnny.

@johnny
As some might not agree with you, atleast you have a sence of humor.

@carstuff, where (what medium) was those numbers posted? The link is to yahoo financials (GM is officially motors liquidation company!) and for life of me I can’t see numbers you are quoting. Yes I read that they had marvelous quarter loosing only 1.25 billions, but where are your numbers coming from? please share.

http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=MTLQQ.PK

@Johnny shut up! We will throw you Canadian wolves! Or wait; can’t do that, you already there

“Bloom added the Obama administration wants to “err on the side of getting out a little faster”.

I appreciate the desire but would rather they try to maximize whatever (or any) returns they can. How about getting out smarter? There is a lot of money already lost in this deal, but there is still a lot of real money at stake.

Concerning the IPO, I won’t be playing with the big institutionals but I might try to pick up a small number of shares afterwards. GM and Ford won’t be going anywhere soon.

I did real well on Apple when it was “in its death spiral” about 7 years ago.

All you have to do is go the completely transparent GM Media website.:)

http://media.gm.com/content/media/us/en/news/news_detail.brand_gm.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2009/Nov/1116_earnings

http://media.gm.com/content/media/us/en/news/news_detail.brand_gm.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2009/Nov/1116_earnings

Krugeri,
The administration wants to get out of GM well before the 2010 elections, and they’ll be happy to break even. This will prevent the “Guvmn’t Moters” crowd from screaming their heads off. If the government does make a significant profit on its return, expect the Right Wing Nuts to somehow spin it into something negative.

picking up apple 7 years ago was timely, i was in apple back then too (actually ~12 years ago now), so i know what those returns look like…but i wouldn’t expect 1000% percent returns from gm or ford from here on out ;P as we were talking about the other day, ford was down to 1.50 in the last year, and is now trading above 8.50…not a bad gain for what in hindsight was an easy bet…and when ford hits 15 bucks a share it will be a legit 10-bagger…but since the economy is more level than last year, you’ll have to look elsewhere for the next 10-bagger…

Ohhhhh, I thought obolshevik and his idiot cronies are not going to be involved in GMs operations, but one day later the lying jackäss in chief is targeting the IPO of the company he stol and gave to his union cronies.

FU BHO. Go away and rot you POS.

@Smegley Wanxalot, do you want to tell us how you really feel about current administration?

@lefty, did you fell off pear tree? Apple was run (again!) by its founder. Steve Jobs invented personal computing in late 70’s, revolutionize music business (iPod, iTunes, iPhone) and produced modern man-machine interface (mouse). What did Whitacker, Geitner and the rest of governing body at GM invented, except perfect careers in bureaucracy (not a small task, but far from being being genius).

@Smegley Wanxalot

Shhhhhh…. The grown ups are talking.

Sorry, Jobs did not produce mouse, but mass produced it and marketed, It was invented in Xerox lab.

@Borat

Not certain Lefty was suggesting that. On the contrary, I think he was stating that he wouldn’t expect similar returns. That said, I think there might be money to be made on the stock in the long-term. Not every transaction needs to be a 400% return to make it worthwhile.

And I agree… not geniuses.

Krugeri, I doubt there are real investors who would risk investment in any form of GM. The institution has a history of failure, poor management and bad labor relationship. What have had change since bankruptcy? And it was not bankruptcy in the real term of the word. It was government intervention, which stripped former shareholders of any value (can’t get anything for those shares) and distributed assets between UAW/CAW and lame management. There were no sales of assets to satisfy either bondholders or shareholders. GM had some large assets (real estate, factories, equipment, scientific and engineering research etc). So when same parties that drove “old” GM into insolvency will sell shares in “new” GM where is guarantee that history will not repeat itself?

GM stock will sell very well next year. You can mark my words. Please do.

I am sure you will invest heavily and will rip handsome profits. Good luck in your endeavor.

Thanks, that is why I retired at 46 and can now stay at home and build furniture for fun!

Anyway the IPO will all depend on what GM can get its market share to and what profit they can get. Right now GM keeps increasing its share. Looks like they are keeping well above the 18% they based their business case on. So it looks like they will be above 20% in the future. Most likely we will see another share increase for November. IF Toyota keeps stumbling some of that market share will go to GM, not that I would bank on that.

As far as profit, GM is the low cost producer in the states now and with the dollar dropping (and sorry to say will probably not go back up for at least 4 years), vehicles being imported, even from Korea, will have a tougher go of it. So GM should be very profitable vs. the competition.

The issue is that GM will have to put out quality/desired product and the last 2 years of products have all been pretty darn great and I do not see any change in future products.

According to the National Taxpayer’s Union report “The Auto Bailout: A Taxpayer Quagmire,” authored by Rochester Institute of Technology Professor of Economics, Thomas D. Hopkins. That number includes the $52.9b taxpayer “investment” in General Motors, as well as GM’s portion of the GMAC bailout, which brings GM’s taxpayer tab to over $60b. Chrysler’s GMAC-inclusive bailout bill totals $17.4b, or $7,600 per vehicle, based on estimated 2009/2010 sales. Don’t believe that GM or Chrysler will match their projections over the next twelve months? The NTU estimates that total government support for the auto industry comes out to $800 per taxpaying American family. These numbers do not include the Cash for Clunkers program, likely future bailouts of GMAC (projected at a further $2b), or Department of Energy retooling loans (ATVML). These numbers also do not reflect the very real possibility that GM, Chrysler and GMAC could continue to drain taxpayer money post-2010. “For each year of survival beyond 2010,” the report warns, “the burden per vehicle would decline [Ed: but not disappear] – so long as no additional government funding is provided Comment

This is pure plagiarism on my part, but report warrants a bit of “borrowing” Comment